Pioneer Elite & DTS-HDMA 7.1

[jcs913]

Anyone else notice that only 5 speakers light up on the Pioneer Elite 92 (or other Pioneer 90 series receivers) receiver display when playing the Shoot Em Up or Pans Labyrinth 7.1 DTS-HDMA track. All 7 of my speakers are active, but only 5 light up on the receivers display???

[MaulxDrth]

Unfortunately, I don't have 7.1 so I wouldn't know. I, myself have the Elite 92 and would like to know the answer to this.

[CAB]

What transport are you using?

[crackinhedz]

does the player allow for 7.1 DTS-HD MA output? (read the fine print under audio specs in the BD player manual...)

[masmole]

Originally Posted by jcs913

Anyone else notice that only 5 speakers light up on the Pioneer Elite 92 (or other Pioneer 90 series receivers) receiver display when playing the Shoot Em Up or Pans Labyrinth 7.1 DTS-HDMA track. All 7 of my speakers are active, but only 5 light up on the receivers display???

If you're using a PS3 to play these movies or are using PCM output to your Pioneer receiver, you will not get 7.1-HDMA track because the PS3 can't decode DTS HDMA and neither will almost all current blu-ray players. You will get either a downmixed DTS audio or the core DTS audio. The only way to get DTS HDMA in some select players except the PS3 is to output it via bitstream (with capable players) and have your Pioneer decode the 7.1 lossless track.

[turboLAZER]

sounds like the pioneer receiver is only getting the core 1.5mbps DTS bitstream and is then using a matrix for getting sound to the rear speakers. you are probably NOT getting a distrete 7.1, but rather 5.1 matrixed into 7.1

[jcs913]

Guys I should have been clearer, I have the only player that bitstreams DTS-HDMA is the Panny 30, which I have. Anyways, I have an update, I played Saw4 yesterday with the DTS-HDMA 7.1 track and all 7 channels light up. Must be something in the metadata on those 2 discs that the Pioneer is not seeing. The PCM 7.1 tracks have all lit up fine, only those 2 discs. Must be a similar problem, like with the RE Extinction TrueHD track.

[crackinhedz]

Originally Posted by jcs913

I have the only player that bitstreams DTS-HDMA is the Panny 30

...not the only player.

[MacDaddyOJack]

Originally Posted by crackinhedz

...not the only player.

There is a Pioneer that can bitstream it as well, I believe that there are three on the market currently.

[jcs913]

Originally Posted by MacDaddyOJack

There is a Pioneer that can bitstream it as well, I believe that there are three on the market currently.

Yeah, that is correct, I forgot, 3 that do it. Although the samsung is said to have problems playing the Fox discs, so who knows if it will play. The Pioneer is an oversight by me. Anyways, has anyone seen this happen on any of these players with Pans Labyrinth?

[quetzalcoatl]

There is a thread over at AVS taking about this and it seems that New Line is not using the standard setup for 7.1. Denon has said that their system will not see it becasue of this. My guess is that the same is happening with the Pioneer. I have spoken with Chris Walker about this and he is looking into it. But does not have any answers yet.

But what it comes down to is it seems like some CEs have very tight guidelines were others are looser. And since there is not a set standard for how 7.1 needs to be we could see these problems for awhile.

[jcs913]

Originally Posted by quetzalcoatl

There is a thread over at AVS taking about this and it seems that New Line is not using the standard setup for 7.1. Denon has said that their system will not see it becasue of this. My guess is that the same is happening with the Pioneer. I have spoken with Chris Walker about this and he is looking into it. But does not have any answers yet.

But what it comes down to is it seems like some CEs have very tight guidelines were others are looser. And since there is not a set standard for how 7.1 needs to be we could see these problems for awhile.

Thanks, I will look for the thread. Like I said though, even though the receiver does not light all 7 channels up, there is discrete sound coming from each channel, very strange.

[quetzalcoatl]

Originally Posted by jcs913

Thanks, I will look for the thread. Like I said though, even though the receiver does not light all 7 channels up, there is discrete sound coming from each channel, very strange.

Here is the link.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=967535

[quetzalcoatl]

Here is some more info on how the Denons are handling it. I would suspect it is the same problem with Pioneer.
Still have not heard back from Chris on this either.
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showp...&postcount=529

[jcs913]

Originally Posted by quetzalcoatl

Here is some more info on how the Denons are handling it. I would suspect it is the same problem with Pioneer.
Still have not heard back from Chris on this either.
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showp...&postcount=529

I also believe the track is playing correctly, as discrete sound is coming from all 7 channels. I just think it has something to do with the receivers recognition of the flag, which would put up those channels on the display if it recognized it. God I hope there is not another firmware upgrade to deal with on the Elite. The one for the 82 series was a huge pain, as lugging that thing to the service center sucked.

[crackinhedz]

Originally Posted by jcs913

God I hope there is not another firmware upgrade to deal with on the Elite. The one for the 82 series was a huge pain, as lugging that thing to the service center sucked.

I have an Elite 81...how would you describe the process of getting the firmware upgrade? what kind of info do you need and how long did it take? did you notice any difference (LFE problem right?)

been debating if I should...I dont notice an LFE issue...but apparently even Pioneer is recommending for the 80' series.

[nyworker3]

i have the pioneer 91txh elite, the speakers do not light up on shoot em up, hairspray-only 5.1 if i play any other company than new line, lionsgate 310 to yuma, war all 7.1 pcm, no problem, xmen last stand, 6.1 dts hd ma, no prob,, even king of new york dts -hd not ma 6.1 no problem with panny bd-30 its got to be a new line problem

[CAB]

Originally Posted by crackinhedz

I have an Elite 81...how would you describe the process of getting the firmware upgrade? what kind of info do you need and how long did it take? did you notice any difference (LFE problem right?)

been debating if I should...I dont notice an LFE issue...but apparently even Pioneer is recommending for the 80' series.

I used an 84TXsi and it had the LFE issue. I called Pioneer and they said it only applies if I am sending LPCM to the unit, and I quote, "which is rare." I responded with "I play mostly LPCM tracks from Blu-ray and TrueHD which decodes to LPCM and my LFE is a bit lower than it should be according to my SPL."

The firmware bumped the LFE by +10db when under certain conditions and I did notice the difference. I have a Pioneer authorized service center in Austin and paid a $30 expedite fee to get it turned same day. It would have been a few weeks if I hadn't.

Call Pioneer and ask them if your model and S/N have the issue. It'll take shipping it off if you don't have a service center local unless they've since come out with a field upgrade tool.

Good luck, man.

[jcs913]

Originally Posted by crackinhedz

I have an Elite 81...how would you describe the process of getting the firmware upgrade? what kind of info do you need and how long did it take? did you notice any difference (LFE problem right?)

been debating if I should...I dont notice an LFE issue...but apparently even Pioneer is recommending for the 80' series.

Like CAB said, it definetly boosts the LFE on LPCM tracks correctly. As you know, LPCM is almost exclusively on BD discs, so you know you may need it. I took mine to a local place, about 10 miles away, the guy did it in about 45 minutes. It was painless, but disconnecting everything and moving it was no fun. It is also about 40 lbs or so. I would try to stay away from sending it away, I heard some bad stories about it. Local is the way to go if you can. The guy required a receipt and did it free of charge, because it was within the 2 year warranty.

[CAB]

Originally Posted by jcs913

Like CAB said, it definetly boosts the LFE on LPCM tracks correctly. As you know, LPCM is almost exclusively on BD discs, so you know you may need it. I took mine to a local place, about 10 miles away, the guy did it in about 45 minutes. It was painless, but disconnecting everything and moving it was no fun. It is also about 40 lbs or so. I would try to stay away from sending it away, I heard some bad stories about it. Local is the way to go if you can. The guy required a receipt and did it free of charge, because it was within the 2 year warranty.

I provided Pioneer the S/N and they created a case number which I provided to the repair center. I'm sure Pioneer paid them for the normal part of the service. Yeah, mine woulda been free if I didn't want to rush it.