3:2 Pulldown Judder on High def Question

[lv426]

I've seen a lot to topics on this forum and others forums, asking why is there judder on slow panning shots on blu-ray films

I am fully aware why this is, if you TV does not refresh at a multiple of 24 (ie 48,72,96 or 120Hz) then the 3:2 pulldown is applied and displayed at 60Hz(60fps)

My understanding of R1 DVDs is they all have 3:2 pulldown applied, yet people moving from DVD to blu only seem to notice judder now.

I can understand people in PAL regions that notice a difference due to the fact that there DVDs had no telecine judder on then due to them speeding the framerate from 24fps to 25fps

So is it that people are scrutinising blu more that they did on DVD, thus seeing anything that out of the ordinary, or is it that players are not as good at applying 3:2 pulldown in real time ?

Any view on this ?

P.S - I hope this is in the correct forum

[aramis109]

Well, some things to keep in mind in DVD judder vs. Blu-ray:

1. More detail in images. This is a biggie. With more detail comes more opportunity to notice the judder. I usually notice it with panning shots with lots of detail, like trees/jungle, lots of parrallel lines like fences or buildings, or generally when there's a lot of static images on the screen. DVD, with having less detail, is going to be less of an issue with noticing this.

2. Most of us weren't watching DVD's on LCD's. We were watching them on some form of CRT. Thus, the static refresh rate was not an issue.

[odin24]

I'm thinking of buying a plasma, it's "Cinema" spec states 3:2 / 2:2. Is that just the same as 3:2 pulldown?

Thanks,

[Sonny]

Originally Posted by odin24

I'm thinking of buying a plasma, it's "Cinema" spec states 3:2 / 2:2. Is that just the same as 3:2 pulldown?

Thanks,

What make & model?

[acleftguard76]

Sounds like it has to be the Panasonic PZ800 or 850...they are the only TV's I know that simply double the frame rate to 48fps...or 2:2. I wish there were a way to turn either off. In any case, the 2:2 pull down, as I stated before, is doubling the native 24p found on BluRay Discs. The 3:2 pull down is adding an extra 12 frames to the film making it 60fps or 60hz. In my experience, stick to the 3:2 pull down, the 2:2 is just way too juddery.

[odin24]

LG 50PG30

Thanks.

[4K2K]

asking why is there judder on slow panning shots on blu-ray films

In my view it's not just 3:2 pull-down judder.

The bigger screens and higher resolutions we currently have probably let you more notice it more (and you're right, people from PAL countries will probably notice 3:2 pulldown judder more).

But with 24fps film, in cinemas don't they flash the image 48 times a second (or something like that), whereas on most LCD HDTVs the backlight is usually constantly on while the frames are displayed so you probably notice more that things are jumping from one position on screen to the next, with no motion in-between those positions.

24fps is a slow rate in comparison to 30fps or 50i/60i of TV. When a film camera pans, the shutter is only open for half the time, so that's going to cause some jumping/juddering as each time the shutter opens the camera has panned a bit more, so the picture is jumping between positions at a lower rate than 50i/60i TV.