1080p TVs DON'T all have the same resolution?

[radagast]

If this has been discussed before, I apologize. I recently noticed that two 42 inch LCD TVs had DIFFERENT resolutions listed for the vertical line count. A Philips 42 inch LCD was something like 1960 X 1080. A Sanyo 42 inch LCD was 1320 X 1080. I never paid attention to the vertical count before. What gives?

[DepTii]

That sounds more like a typo than anything else (technically, a 1080p has to be 1920x1080).

On the same topic, check out this article for an in depth look at static and motion resolution for major TVs, as even though some TVs are 1080p, they may not display all 1080 lines of resolution.

[radagast]

Originally Posted by DepTii

That sounds more like a typo than anything else (technically, a 1080p has to be 1920x1080).

On the same topic, check out this article for an in depth look at static and motion resolution for major TVs, as even though some TVs are 1080p, they may not display all 1080 lines of resolution.

Thanks.

[dobyblue]

Originally Posted by DepTii

That sounds more like a typo than anything else (technically, a 1080p has to be 1920x1080).

That's not correct. A 1080p TV can have 1080 vertical lines of resolution, but not have 1920 lines of horizontal resolution.

There are instance of both 1080 and 720/768 sets like this.

This Hitachi for example - http://www.amazon.com/Hitachi-P50T50...cm_cr-mr-title

It's 1080p, it accepts a 1080p signal, but it's 1280x1080

This Samsung 720p tv - http://www.samsung.com/ca/consumer/d...XZC&fullspec=F

It's 1024x768

1080 vertical line TV's normally have 1920x1080 panels, but it's not exclusive.

[PanasonicPlasmaMan]

yea as long as it has 1080p vertical the horizantel lines can be anything higher.

[4K2K]

So look for a tv that says Full 1080p

[DepTii]

Originally Posted by dobyblue

That's not correct. A 1080p TV can have 1080 vertical lines of resolution, but not have 1920 lines of horizontal resolution.

There are instance of both 1080 and 720/768 sets like this.

This Hitachi for example - http://www.amazon.com/Hitachi-P50T50...cm_cr-mr-title

It's 1080p, it accepts a 1080p signal, but it's 1280x1080

Technically, any TV can accept a 1080p signal but what it does with it after that is up to the TV. As that page for the Hitachi says, it's not full 1080p but something of a mix between 720p and 1080p, so meh. By definition, 1080p is 1920x1080 resolution. Anything less than that, and for all intents and purpose it's NOT 1080p. Seems like more a marketing scheme than anything else.

[dobyblue]

Originally Posted by DepTii

Technically, any TV can accept a 1080p signal but what it does with it after that is up to the TV. As that page for the Hitachi says, it's not full 1080p but something of a mix between 720p and 1080p, so meh. By definition, 1080p is 1920x1080 resolution. Anything less than that, and for all intents and purpose it's NOT 1080p. Seems like more a marketing scheme than anything else.

You are incorrect.

Tell me that a 1.66:1 movie is supposed to be 1920x1080 when it's 1080p?
It's not.

How about a 2.39:1 movie?
It's not.

The Hitachi is not a "mix" between 720p and 1080p - it's a 1080p TV, it's just not 16:9.
Were it a 1366x768 panel then it's a 768p TV.

In addition to that not every TV can "technically" accept a 1080p signal, there are plenty of models on the market that can't.

By definition a 1080p signal is a 1080 line signal that's progressive, as opposed to interlaced. The horizontal resolution, while normally 1920, is not measured in the signal. There is no definition like the one you describe.

[DepTii]

I get what you're trying to say, but I think we're talking about two different things. You're referring to vertical lines of resolution, I'm thinking of an actual pixel by pixel resolution, as when I think of 1080p I'm thinking of the native resolution that the majority of 1080p TVs use, 1920x1080. Also, I understand that AR effects the resolution actually SEEN, but the signal transported by a blu-ray player, for example, is going to be 1920x1080.

I'm just trying to say that what the TV is claiming to be is deceptive to the customer (who may be wanting to purchase it for blu-ray use, for example), as even the description on the Amazon page clearly states "while it is not the full 1080p resolution, it has a better resolution than 720p panels at a similar price." That was my point in it's entirety really.

[krazeyeyez]

honestly with all that goes into HIDEF and the great experience it brings, its all deceptive to the regular customer, at least the ones that don't do proper research. i wonder how many people get home, throw in a 2:35 oar movie and then freak about the black bars, or have no idea there tv was calibrated for a brightly lit store aka torch mode, or the kicker which i have been to a few peoples houses and found this in action, NO HDMI, and no clue what it is *smacks forehead*.

not tv related but i love when people are feeding their AVR with left and right analog, 2 of my friends were doing this until i got the call to ask why they couldn't change surround mode off of "that PLII thing" LOL. i blame the people for not doing research on such a major purchase, i also blame dealers that don't properly educate their employee's.

[aramis109]

Originally Posted by krazeyeyez

honestly with all that goes into HIDEF and the great experience it brings, its all deceptive to the regular customer, at least the ones that don't do proper research. i wonder how many people get home, throw in a 2:35 oar movie and then freak about the black bars, or have no idea there tv was calibrated for a brightly lit store aka torch mode, or the kicker which i have been to a few peoples houses and found this in action, NO HDMI, and no clue what it is *smacks forehead*.

not tv related but i love when people are feeding their AVR with left and right analog, 2 of my friends were doing this until i got the call to ask why they couldn't change surround mode off of "that PLII thing" LOL. i blame the people for not doing research on such a major purchase, i also blame dealers that don't properly educate their employee's.

Ain't that the truth. I was looking at woot.com's deal today (Philips 42" 1080p set for $799) and while I was scanning the comments, I read things like "So this is an LCD and not an HDTV?" and "720p and 1080i are broadcast, 1080p is 'blueray'" and things of that nature. J6P still doesn't "get it".

[dobyblue]

Originally Posted by DepTii

Also, I understand that AR effects the resolution actually SEEN, but the signal transported by a blu-ray player, for example, is going to be 1920x1080.

No it's not - Blu-ray is not affected like this in the same way that "framed" anamorphic widescreen DVD's are.

If it's 1920x1080, then it's a 1.78:1 movie.

Other than that, the horizontal resolution from the Blu-ray Disc varies by aspect ratio.

[HDTV1080P]

In the United States all displays that are labeled 1080P are required to have 1920 X 1080 which is slightly over 2 million pixels. Some other countries it might be possible to find diffrent marketing standards that allow 1080P to be labeled different.

[HDTV1080P]

Now 1080I displays are not required to have 1920 vertical lines. It is almost impossible to find a large 1080I display that displays 1920 X 1080I, most CRT's are around 1380 X 1080I. I have seen a few 9 inch CRT front projectors that handle 1920 X 1080I. My understanding on the Hitachi P50T501 Plasma is that it accepts 1080P input but down converts it to 1080I before displaying it. No where in the offical product literature does it say 1080P resolution.
Link to official product sheet.

Product Sheet

[dobyblue]

Originally Posted by HDTV1080P

In the United States all displays that are labeled 1080P are required to have 1920 X 1080 which is slightly over 2 million pixels. Some other countries it might be possible to find diffrent marketing standards that allow 1080P to be labeled different.

Can you point us to this law? There are tv's with 1080p labels that only define handshaking, 768p panels even. I would like to see the law you are talking about and how it is worded.

[dobyblue]

Originally Posted by HDTV1080P

Now 1080I displays are not required to have 1920 vertical lines. It is almost impossible to find a large 1080I display that displays 1920 X 1080I, most CRT's are around 1380 X 1080I. I have seen a few 9 inch CRT front projectors that handle 1920 X 1080I. My understanding on the Hitachi P50T501 Plasma is that it accepts 1080P input but down converts it to 1080I before displaying it. No where in the offical product literature does it say 1080P resolution.
Link to official product sheet.

Product Sheet

1080p to 1080i is not "down converting" as no resolution is lost.

[HDTV1080P]

These Hitachi's are 1080P with true refresh rates at multiplies of the original frame. The product specs labels them as 1080P.
Hitachi P50X902 (48HZ Plasma)

Hitachi P50V702 (48HZ Plasma)

Hitachi P50S602 (48HZ Plasma)

The following Hitachi is labeled as 1080 since it is not a true 1080P display. It is a 1080I display. Hitachi made some rare plasmas that are 1080I.

Product Sheet

[HDTV1080P]

Here is a detailed review on a 2007 Hitachi 1080I Plasma

http://schoolofhdtv.com/index.php?/H...H401-Plasma-TV

[dobyblue]

Originally Posted by HDTV1080P

Here is a detailed review on a 2007 Hitachi 1080I Plasma

http://schoolofhdtv.com/index.php?/H...H401-Plasma-TV

You are correct, it employs Hitachi's Alternate Lighting of Surfaces interlaced technology. However they note:

Hitachi executives said that all models this year will have 1080 resolution, although by this they refer only to vertical lines of resolution and not necessarily to interlaced or progressive display techniques.

I know of no law that states you have to have a 1920x1080 panel to put "1080p" in the name of your set, even though most CE's have finally started adhering to this standard to avoid consumer confusion.

Likewise most CE's have stopped calling their 1366x768 LCD and plasma sets "1080i" as they neither have 1080 lines of vertical resolution nor do they support interlaced display panels.

It appears that ALL of Hitachi's 2007 plasma's were using ALiS, and none were true progressive panels, converting 1080p24 to 1080i60.