Star Wars: The Complete Saga (1977-2005)

[seannyd]

Out of curiosity has Disney removed the Paramount logo from their reissues of the first couple of Marvel movies?

[Geoff D]

Originally Posted by seannyd

Out of curiosity has Disney removed the Paramount logo from their reissues of the first couple of Marvel movies?

Apparently not, and seeing as Paramount retained the rights to distribute the 4 existing Indiana Jones pictures I'm not surprised, they probably made sure it was a lot more watertight. And did Marvel finance any of the movies entirely themselves or did the cash come from Paramount? I ask because Fox's involvement with actually funding Star Wars ended after the first film, whereas if Paramount co-funded the Phase 1 flicks then their contribution won't be so easily erased.

[Gold Ranger]

Originally Posted by Geoff D

Apparently not, and seeing as Paramount retained the rights to distribute the 4 existing Indiana Jones pictures I'm not surprised, they probably made sure it was a lot more watertight. And did Marvel finance any of the movies entirely themselves or did the cash come from Paramount? I ask because Fox's involvement with actually funding Star Wars ended after the first film, whereas if Paramount co-funded the Phase 1 flicks then their contribution won't be so easily erased.

Completely Marvel funded, if I remember correctly. They took out a huge Loan from a bank, I forget which one at the moment.
They bid out for Distribution.
Disney paid to have the Distribution ended early.

[Dynamo of Eternia]

Originally Posted by seannyd

I almost feel like the new theme is TOO Williams-ish.

That's kind of how I feel about it. Not only is it too "Williams-ish," it's too "Star Wars-ish" (because, of course, it is from Star Wars).

While the Fox fanfar stood on it's own as a lead-in for the Star Wars theme.... making them work well together, but still being distinctly different, this attempt to replace it is like giving us a sample of the music we are about to hear.

I appreciate what they are trying to do with it, but the execution is poor.

I frankly would rather there be silence over the Lucasfilm logo, then have it lead into the "boom" of the SW theme than stick with this.



In the grand scheme of things, it's not the end of the world. It's by far one of the more tollerable SW changes, but something that I'm still not thrilled about.

[Geoff D]

Originally Posted by Gold Ranger

Completely Marvel funded, if I remember correctly. They took out a huge Loan from a bank, I forget which one at the moment.
They bid out for Distribution.
Disney paid to have the Distribution ended early.

Right, thanks. But I still think that their logo won't be sloughed off as easily as Fox with Star Wars. Paramount might've put a moratorium on Disney removing the their logo for x amount of years in the buyout contract, whereas Fox were always bound by the agreements that Lucas played hardball over in the wake of the success of the original SW film.

[Scarface32]

What was wrong with the old logo? Elegant and simple. Instead they had to bling it up.

[RBBrittain]

Originally Posted by Geoff D

Right, thanks. But I still think that their logo won't be sloughed off as easily as Fox with Star Wars. Paramount might've put a moratorium on Disney removing the their logo for x amount of years in the buyout contract, whereas Fox were always bound by the agreements that Lucas played hardball over in the wake of the success of the original SW film.

Not to mention the MCU titles were probably in the same contract as The Avengers & Iron Man 3, both of which still carried the Paramount logo even though Disney bought out their distribution rights.

While this thread was locked, disneywildcat posted in the SW thread in Digital Movies this language from Disney's 2014 annual report clarifying SW movie rights (bold per his post):

Prior to the Company’s acquisition, Lucasfilm produced six Star Wars films (Episodes 1 through 6). Lucasfilm retained the rights to consumer products related to all of those films and the rights related to television and electronic distribution formats for all of those films, with the exception of the rights for Episode 4, which are owned by a third-party studio. All of the films are distributed by a third-party studio in the theatrical and home entertainment markets. The theatrical and home entertainment distribution rights for these films revert back to Lucasfilm in May 2020 with the exception of Episode 4, for which these distribution rights are retained in perpetuity by the third-party studio.

In other words, "electronic distribution" (streaming) was excluded from Fox's non-Ep IV rights even before Disney bought Lucasfilm. I assume from this that Disney would have had to license Fox's logo & fanfare separately to retain them in the streaming editions, since there was no other contract between Disney & Fox to attach a logo preservation clause to.

[octagon]

Originally Posted by Geoff D

No probs with the idea, but the execution ain't great.

The execution is pretty bad (my exact reaction was 'ah, so this is what photoshopped music sounds like) and I'm not crazy about the idea either.

They can open Episode VII however they want. It's their film. And yes, they can make whatever changes they want to the first six as well. Those are their films too.

But I don't have to like whatever changes they might make and I'm one who believes original studio logos are part of a film and shouldn't be tinkered with lightly.

Hell, I don't even like when studios replace their old logos with newer ones on their own catalog titles.

[rdodolak]

Originally Posted by octagon

The execution is pretty bad (my exact reaction was 'ah, so this is what photoshopped music sounds like) and I'm not crazy about the idea either.

They can open Episode VII however they want. It's their film. And yes, they can make whatever changes they want to the first six as well. Those are their films too.

But I don't have to like whatever changes they might make and I'm one who believes original studio logos are part of a film and shouldn't be tinkered with lightly.

Hell, I don't even like when studios replace their old logos with newer ones on their own catalog titles.

They don't own Episode 4 so the can't make changes to it without Fox's consent.

[octagon]

Originally Posted by rdodolak

They don't own Episode 4 so the can't make changes to it without Fox's consent.

They can do whatever they want to Episode 4 except distribute it themselves.

[stvn1974]

Originally Posted by Scarface32

What was wrong with the old logo? Elegant and simple. Instead they had to bling it up.

I wish the new Lucasfilm logo blinked. That would be awesome.

[popeflick]

Too "Star Wars-y" to "John Williams-y" : exhibit 1 that some fans will just complain about anything.

Here's a fact of life: when you think you've seen it all, you'll see some more.

[BaronVH]

I shall post an opinion that many may disagree with. I did not like Han shooting first, guns removed with E.T., or any other changes. The intro logo slightly bothers me due to the memories associated from watching these movies. However, if it weren't for Disney, we would never have gotten any more movies. They also seem to be going all-in with these like they have with Marvel. If they make these movies half as good as the Marvel ones, then they can do whatever the hell they want with the intro to the Star Wars films absent inserting Mickey Mouse into them.

[StingingVelvet]

So Disney's marketing worked on me, just not in the way they intended. Yesterday I FINALLY bought the BD collection. I wanted to finally watch these movies again (it has been years) and with the big digital push I really doubt a new set will come this year. Last night I marathon'd the prequels. Some thoughts:

Good lord Phantom Menace is terrible. I had these vague memories of it being relatively okay but ruined by Jar Jar and that's not the case at ALL. It's a terrible movie all over, with horrible writing and acting throughout. The pod race is fun and the lightsaber fights are exciting but literally everything else is bad, except maybe short little Natalie Portman being in charge toward the end and Williams' music. Also the BD look freaking disgusting. WTF?

Attack of the Clones is relatively enjoyable for a sci-fi fan. It still has terrible writing and Christensen is once again a terrible actor for Anakin, but the movie has much improved visual flair and set-pieces. I mean, I'm not saying it's good, but I enjoyed watching it. The all CGI all the time feel of it is probably my biggest issue with it (and the next one). That Kamino setting and fight might be my favorite part of all three prequels. The BD looks decent, but it's depressing knowing this is the best the film will ever look no matter what.

Revenge of the Sith is a legitimately good Star Wars movie I think. It still has some poorly written sections and the all CGI feel that drives me nuts, but it has some good writing in there too and Christensen has learned to act a bit. The mood and plot are good, and the settings are all solid. The action scenes are fun. Even has some good direction (one day you might grow up to be a good director George! Hmmmmm). Not great, but solidly good. Maybe better than Return of the Jedi, I will find out tonight. BD looked pretty damn good but not as amazing as reviews acted like.

All around a middling experience but enjoyable. Watched the "overviews" on the special features disc and they were okay, but the DVD special features were ten times better. Looking forward to the OG tonight.

Thanks for reading this 4 years too late evaluation.

[stvn1974]

I found the first release of the prequels on BD in mint condition at an estate sale this weekend for $15.00 and decided to pick it up since I haven't seen them since netflixing the discs when they first became available.


Phantom Menace 3/5
My favorite of the prequels still. Jake Lloyd is not as bad as everyone claims. Whenever Jar Jar is about to speak I just tell myself it could be worse, they could have had Kate Capshaw (the true winner of the most annoying character of all time as Willie in Temple Of Doom) in the part. I liked the opening of the film where we are introduced to Obi-Wan and Qui Gon and I like the action and how it sets up the film with Palpatine and the trade federation. I don't dislike the trade embargo plotline like so many seem too. I still enjoy the pod race and actually like that it was extended. Lightsaber battles are great especially the last with cutting back and forth between it, the space fight, the Gungan battle and the taking of the city by the Queen Amidala. To me it The Phantom Menace feels like a Star Wars film.

Attack Of The Clones 1/5
Sitting through this film is still one of the most painful experiences I have ever experienced. Hayden Christensen is terrible and every time a human being opens their mouth to say something I cringe. The "romance" is so bad that I swear Stephanie Meyer couldn't do worse. Boba Fett being a clone takes some of the awesome out of the character and the kid that plays him only has two lines in the film and can't even say them convincingly. I don't care if there were practical effects used in the film, everything still looks like a bad cartoon. The chase scene at the beginning where Obi-Wan and Anakin are chasing the assassin, the Jedi assault on the auditorium and the final battle between the clones and droid army give me a headache with all the shit that is on the screen. The "I Love Lucy" scene of the droid manufacturing line is the worst thing in the entire saga. C3PO saying "switch me off" should have been enough to get some law passed making it illegal for Lucas to write Episode III. I do like the final showdown with Count Dooku and the Yoda being a bad ass still makes me smile. I love badass Yoda so much that I bought the Sideshow Yoda figure which is the only prequel merchandise I own.

Revenge Of The Sith 2/5
I am not in love with this film as some seem to be. To say it is as good as Return Of The Jedi is laughable and those who like it more shouldn't be allowed to watch films anymore. The opening to save Palpatine is as mind numbing bad as scenes that I had a problem with in Clones. More bad "romance" and the actual plot of the film is terrible. The Jedi are made to be morons, Yoda a dolt and it took longer to pop the popcorn that I ate than it did for Anakin to turn to the darkside. Plus the whole killing of kids makes me not give a damn about Luke wanting to save him. Also the way Padme went out and the plot holes/continuity errors caused by Lucas not being competent is inexcusable.

I have the despecialized versions of the Original Trilogy and will never watch the special editions again. Here is hoping that Disney gives us UOT quality in the future.

[Geoff D]

Originally Posted by RBBrittain

Not to mention the MCU titles were probably in the same contract as The Avengers & Iron Man 3, both of which still carried the Paramount logo even though Disney bought out their distribution rights.

While this thread was locked, disneywildcat posted in the SW thread in Digital Movies this language from Disney's 2014 annual report clarifying SW movie rights (bold per his post):
In other words, "electronic distribution" (streaming) was excluded from Fox's non-Ep IV rights even before Disney bought Lucasfilm. I assume from this that Disney would have had to license Fox's logo & fanfare separately to retain them in the streaming editions, since there was no other contract between Disney & Fox to attach a logo preservation clause to.

That makes a lot of sense as to the current situation. The Fox logo's not there because their rights never even covered digital distribution in the first place. I doubt such stuff was thought of in the '70s although I'm a little surprised that Fox didn't think of covering that as far as the prequel trilogy was concerned, the rights for which were negotiated years after the OT. But Lucas being Lucas he probably told them "you're getting no greater rights than the original films, take it or leave it. Oh, and by the way I want some other stuff too...".

Yeah, the Fox logo IS there for Ep IV because their perpetual distribution deal obviously covers any and all formats, including those not even thought of at the time the movie was made, because it'd be kinda stupid to have the rights in perpetuity and then only be limited to physical media or whatever, so there's a contractual catch-all that includes EVERY method of distribution past, present, and future.

To be perfectly honest I don't think it even matters who actually owns the original film because Fox have the rights to distribute it forever on any format. Disney/LFL own the intellectual property and can do with it as they wish, but as far as any exhibitions of that specific film are concerned, it's Fox that effectively 'own' it for that purpose. Paramount held on to the rights for the existing Indy's in a similar fashion. Sure, they gave up the character and any other ancillary rights, but they retained the rights to the films themselves in the only way that really matters today: distribution.

So, until Fox's deal expires at the end of the decade then we WILL see the Fox logo ahead of the originals & prequels when viewing them in the cinema or on physical media, e.g. if there are any new Blu-ray releases between now and then. I suppose there's always the chance that Disney might buy out Fox's deal early, especially if Ep VII makes a gazillion dollars, but it's only five years away and Disney have got the rights for 5 out of 6 in the biggest emerging market (streaming/VOD) anyway. They'd be better off saving that money and putting it towards pursuing the complete consolidation of Ep 4's rights after 2020.

[Geoff D]

@stvn1974: I agree about Phantom Menace, it's the only one of the prequels that actually feels like a proper Star Wars film to me. Clones is pish until the Geonosis throwdown. But I really like Sith, I honestly think it's a better movie (as in beginning, middle, end) than Jedi because the latter is basically a giant third act of one story whereas Sith has its own internal stories to tell (all of the prequels feel somewhat disconnected in that way, unlike the OT which takes place in a much shorter span of time). But by its very nature Jedi has the more climactic set-pieces which still give me the goosebumps, so it's a tough one to call in terms of sheer emotion.

[StingingVelvet]

I do think Phantom Menace feels the most like classic Star Wars, but that doesn't make up for what a terrible movie it is.

[MechaGodzilla]

While I do think Sith is a pretty good movie all around, and the best of the prequels, it's always been an easy choice for me in regards to which is better between it and Jedi. Sith's flaws are much more glaring to me, and Jedi never makes me cringe.

[Geoff D]

Jedi didn't make me cringe either, until Lucas added those creepy blinking Ewoks and changed Artoo's bunker freak out and put that Godawful "Nooooo....NOOOOooOOOOO!" right on top of one of those spine-tingling climactic moments I was talking about.