Star Wars: The Complete Saga (1977-2005)

[Dynamo of Eternia]

Originally Posted by Bluyoda

Let me ask you this: If you had put all your money and resources into building an empire that enabled you to make the movies YOU had always wanted to make, without any interference from anyone, would you then go and hire people who tell you: No, that's not right. Do it this way!?????

Doesn't make sense, does it?

Well, if you know anything about George Lucas, then you would know that he hated studio interference, and I think it's safe to say that he had earned it to make the movies HE wanted to make.

His movies were independant films. He could do whatever he wanted, and that's good.

But wouldn't a film maker who is trying to make a film that he wants to make want to surround himself with people that will help accomplish that, including when it means perhaps making a suggestion that will lead to an overall better outcome that everyone involved, even said filmmaker, is happy with? Possibly happier than what it would be without said suggestions?


I always find the documentaries, commentaries, etc. for Back to the Future to be interesting because when it came to writing and planning on the story and script, Robert Zemeckis and Bob Gale had a policy that everything was up for debate and all ideas (even those that challenge the ideas already on the table) are welcome. They checked their egos at the door, and the purpose was to make the best movie that they possibly could. And IMO they made a damn good one, with a lot of small details in addition to the bigger ones all weaved together into a well thought out, acted, and told story.


Lucas knew at least some of his weaknesses. He was not an "actor's director." That's a big part of why he didn't direct TESB and ROTJ. He had other collaborators on the OT, especially the first two films of it. He parted ways with some of them for ROTJ, and many consider it to be the lesser film of the OT, despite even having someone else directing it.

Sometimes making the best version of a film that someone wants to make involves taking suggestions from others to improve upon the core idea.

At the end of the day film is a colaborative medium. It can be fairly argued that for any given film, some people have more important roles (whether it be in front of or behing the camera) than others, but everyone plays their part. While Lucas is, of course, an extremely important "cog" in the "machine" that made Star Wars (it wouldn't exist without him), none of these films are something that he could achieve on his own.


Besides, how do we really know if he truly is even satisfied with how the prequels came out? I don't recall him saying so (and even if he didn, it's not like he's never contradicted himself before).

It's not like he's an open book when it comes to these things. He was open about his disapointment with how the OT turned out (largely due to the technology limitations of the time) when he was first coming out with the Special Editions, but that's about it. Even when it comes to the subsequent changes in the DVD and BD releases, it's not like he's come out and talked extensively (or at all) about why he has made those additional changes. While we can take a few guesses, we can't say for sure what was going through his head.

And likewise the same is likely true for the PT. Some tweaks have happened there as well since (the biggest being CGI Yoda in Phantom Menace), but there's very little that can be "fixed" with CGI effects in the PT. Lucas may not be entirely thrilled with how they turn out. He may at least somewhat feel the same way about some of the performances in those films (and his ability to direct them) as others feel. He's not going to admit that publically. He has stated his frustration with the amount and frequency of the fan complaints, and apparently doesn't think highly of fan edits, but that doesn't mean that he's perfectly satisfied with the films that he made. That is speculation on your part.


It's been more than proven that Lucas has more than a complicated relationship with his art, and couldn't stop tinkering with it until he finally sold it off entirely. Frankly I think the best thing that he could do for the sake of both his art and the fans of it is let it go. Because he really hasn't been doing it too many favors for roughly the past 20 years.

He took something that was plainly and simply beloved by many fans, and turned it into a very complicated love/hate relationship for a significant portion of those fans. Now things finally seem to be starting to get on the right track after all of this time if the Ep VII trailer is any indication.

[StingingVelvet]

Originally Posted by Bluyoda

Let me ask you this: If you had put all your money and resources into building an empire that enabled you to make the movies YOU had always wanted to make, without any interference from anyone, would you then go and hire people who tell you: No, that's not right. Do it this way!?????

Doesn't make sense, does it?

No one is saying he was morally wrong to take full control. We're saying no one reigning him in or giving constructive feedback hurt the movies. If you ever watch documentaries or listen to commentaries you'll know movies are a collaborative medium.

[Arch Stanton]

Originally Posted by klauswhereareyou

The funny thing is that I think originally Lucas didn't even want to direct the prequels, but peer pressure from Spielberg and Coppola made him change his mind.

IIRC he wanted Spielberg to do II after the negative response to Phantom Menace.

[Stinky-Dinkins]

Originally Posted by Bluyoda

Let me ask you this: If you had put all your money and resources into building an empire that enabled you to make the movies YOU had always wanted to make, without any interference from anyone, would you then go and hire people who tell you: No, that's not right. Do it this way!?????

Doesn't make sense, does it?

A competent film maker embraces creative collaboration, and that includes thoughtful critique. It makes sense for Lucas to realize that the reason the original Star Wars films (the first two especially) were so overwhelmingly embraced, the very films that built his empire, was because they were a combination of his vision and extensive creative input from others. He can do whatever he pleases, and he obviously did, but without "interference" the first films would have been as lackluster as the prequels turned out to be in its absence.

[chip75]

Originally Posted by Bluyoda

Let me ask you this: If you had put all your money and resources into building an empire that enabled you to make the movies YOU had always wanted to make, without any interference from anyone, would you then go and hire people who tell you: No, that's not right. Do it this way!?????

Architects go and design beautiful homes all by themselves, but on occasion they end up putting a toilet-bowl in the middle of the family room, just because they think it will look "cool", they forget that their poop stinks just as much as everyone else's ...

[Stinky-Dinkins]

Originally Posted by chip75

Architects go and design beautiful homes all by themselves, but on occasion they end up putting a toilet-bowl in the middle of the family room, just because they think it will look "cool", they forget that their poop stinks just as much as everyone else's ...

Oh please. You can go on acting like you don't have a shit bucket in the middle of your living room if that makes you feel better, but I know the truth.

[chip75]

Originally Posted by Stinky-Dinkins

Oh please. You can go on acting like you don't have a shit bucket in the middle of your living room if that makes you feel better, but I know the truth.

I go in the corner, just like the cat, but we're in opposite corners and have scheduled popping times allotted.

[Stinky-Dinkins]

Originally Posted by chip75

I go in the corner, just like the cat, but we're in opposite corners and have scheduled popping times allotted.

That freaks me out only because I know you only have one litter box and it's in the cat's corner.

[Gold Ranger]

Originally Posted by Arch Stanton

IIRC he wanted Spielberg to do II after the negative response to Phantom Menace.

Correct.

[Gold Ranger]

What should have happened is that Lucas should have stated his intention of each movie and the trilogy in general.
Explain the big plot points and beats he wanted to have be hit in each movie and let others fill in the movie around those.
That way, Lucas' vision stays intact, but more capable hands can guide it.

[Stinky-Dinkins]

Originally Posted by Gold Ranger

What should have happened is that Lucas should have stated his intention of each movie and the trilogy in general.
Explain the big plot points and beats he wanted to have be hit in each movie and let others fill in the movie around those.

Even then man, I dunno. if I was one of the people tasked with filling the movies around his plot points I would've been like "George buddy, do we really want to dedicate the entire first movie to a go-cart race and an annoying rastafalien?"

[dvdmike]

Senior Spielbergo still directed the best bits of 3.

[kobol]

Originally Posted by dvdmike

Senior Spielbergo still directed the best bits of 3.

If you're serious, do you know which ones?

[dvdmike]

Originally Posted by kobol

If you're serious, do you know which ones?

He had major input on the opening battle and the end fight.

[JackKnightStarman]

If there was ever a commentary to listen to about the prequels, ep III is it. It is my favorite of all of the and really changed how I look at that film. I went from loving it, to feeling it is as big a misstep as ep I.

Someone on DVDTalk recommended it back when it was released on DVD in 2005. I waited about a year before I actually did. Very informative...and I think truly shows where and what Lucas's strengths and shortcomings were in terms of his doing it "his" way, with all Yes men, and not collaboration.

[Thomas Guycott]

Originally Posted by chip75

Architects go and design beautiful homes all by themselves, but on occasion they end up putting a toilet-bowl in the middle of the family room, just because they think it will look "cool", they forget that their poop stinks just as much as everyone else's ...

From my own experience with architects, it's more like they stick a toilet in the middle of the family room because they forgot to include the bathroom.

[Jett Rink]

Originally Posted by MifuneFan

These go on sale in 20 mins . $35 each, $100 for the set. They will sell out fast. Rick, you ready?

http://www.bottleneckgallery.com/?mc...eid=0f68509bb1

[Show spoiler]Luke

Yoda

Vader

[Show spoiler]

Sold out already. Why is it so hard to find quality Star Wars art like this to buy? The stuff on etsy is just not cutting it for me.

[rickah88]

Originally Posted by MifuneFan

These go on sale in 20 mins . $35 each, $100 for the set. They will sell out fast. Rick, you ready?

http://www.bottleneckgallery.com/?mc...eid=0f68509bb1

[Show spoiler]Luke

Yoda

[Show spoiler]

Haha! I saw this email at 11:55am today and figured, SWEET! I'm golden.
No lie, I logged on, hit refreash, added the tri-pack to my cart, went to check out....Gone by 12:01.
Unbelievable!!

A bummer, because they said in the email I could combine with the EFNY glow print I had ordered over the weekend to save on shipping!

[Himmel]

How about this art:

[Show spoiler]Revenge of a True Sith.

[svenge]

Originally Posted by Terminated

How about this art:

[Show spoiler]Revenge of a True Sith.

That's the worst digitally-manipulated image of Hayden Christensen since his "Force Ghost" appearance in ROTJ...