Star Wars: The Complete Saga (1977-2005)

[Bluyoda]

Originally Posted by IndefinentBlu

I wonder if Lucas will show us the scene in EP2 when N'SYNC comes in at the end during the battle.

I remember hearing about that but Lucas cut that scene.

**NOTE**

I AM NOT, I REPEAT NOT AN N'SYNC FAN.

When I read that they would appear in AOTC I was seriously doubting George' sanity. I understand that he wanted to do it for his daughter, who was a fan, but this just went WAY too far!!!

I would definitely boycott SW forever if he dared put that back into the film again.

[Beast]

Originally Posted by greg_achen

Four hours discussing films you hate?

I don't care if someone hates the prequels, but obsessing over something you hate just seems weird. At least with people who blindly and perhaps illogically love the prequels are obsessing over something they love. Some Star Wars fans I will just never understand. Some make the films deeper and better than they really are and some characterize them as far worse than the reality of it. And then there are those in the middle who appreciate the films for what they are; perfectly imperfect escapist entertainment.

Indeed. Sounds like the reviewer has some sick mental obsession with trashing the movies. He needs to get out of his parent's basement.

Someone please recommend I seek help if I ever make a 4 hour video about how much bad the Nolan Batfilms are.

[longhornsgirl]

Originally Posted by STARKILLER--1138

Parallel, more like surpassed when he had Yoda come in to face Dooku in a scene of ultimate badassery. Imagine what could have been in ESB if Yoda had went with Luke to Cloud City instead of hobbling his muppet ass along back on Dagobah. Oh what could have been.

The Yoda of the OT had a magical quality to him and was there to teach us about the force. The Yoda of the PT was there to just jump around and do videogame crap.

[Rinzler]

So (man do I sound like an artist) I had a rediscovery this weekend of my love of the PT. For years I have stared at the backs of the DVDs and looked at the special features listing thinking "man I should watch these one day", and last weekend I put in Phantom Menace's disc and I so enjoyed the features, I decided to watch TPM, partly because I love it, and partly to look at what I noticed in the making-of docs. I have always enjoyed TPM, so, naturally, I loved it, never got the hate and Jar Jar made me die as a kid and frankly he isn't bad, (to me). Then I watched AOTC's features and was less impressed with them and I LOVED the movie when I was younger, primarily because of the Geonosian action at the end. I watched the movie and for some reason loved it again except for a few elements. I am liking them more, so I am really psyched for the BD sets. Will be watching ROTS on a day where I can be depressed... that movie puts me in a funk for the rest of the day. (Seeing Padme die does most of it, and Aayla Secura's death does not help). Then on to the OT! I will provide my thoughts to see what you guys think!

[JamesKurtovich]

I was sad at the end of the Revenge of the Sith review. I laughed so hard at all of them.

Quickest 4 hours ever. Though for me it might be less since I skip the non-SW portions.

strong replay value though

[the sordid sentinel]

Originally Posted by greg_achen

Four hours discussing films you hate?

I don't care if someone hates the prequels, but obsessing over something you hate just seems weird. At least with people who blindly and perhaps illogically love the prequels are obsessing over something they love. Some Star Wars fans I will just never understand. Some make the films deeper and better than they really are and some characterize them as far worse than the reality of it. And then there are those in the middle who appreciate the films for what they are; perfectly imperfect escapist entertainment.

I completely agree with you. Well said.

[Dynamo of Eternia]

Originally Posted by greg_achen

Four hours discussing films you hate?

I don't care if someone hates the prequels, but obsessing over something you hate just seems weird. At least with people who blindly and perhaps illogically love the prequels are obsessing over something they love. Some Star Wars fans I will just never understand. Some make the films deeper and better than they really are and some characterize them as far worse than the reality of it. And then there are those in the middle who appreciate the films for what they are; perfectly imperfect escapist entertainment.

Originally Posted by Beast

Indeed. Sounds like the reviewer has some sick mental obsession with trashing the movies. He needs to get out of his parent's basement.

Someone please recommend I seek help if I ever make a 4 hour video about how much bad the Nolan Batfilms are.

"Indeed" nothing.

Yes, the reviews are long... because they are thorough. And they make a lot of very good points. It's not just "fanboy whining" as many (such as Beast) like to just assume.

Regardless of whether or not you agree with what is being said, it is a very well thought out critical breakdown of the films. It's not just the typical "fanboy rhetoric".

Besides, most film critics have spent WAY more than 4 hours over the course of their careers writing reviews for films that they haven't liked.

Furthermore, neither of you, nor anyone else who hasn't watched more than just a few minutes of one of these videos, is in any position to judge them as a whole since you haven't actually watched them. The guy may be putting a lot of time and effort into pointing out the negative aspects of the PT, but at least he's actually seen them and therefore has enough knowledge and familiarity with them to be able to form a legitimate opinion of them. The same CANNOT be said for your opinions of these review videos.

And really, what is that magic amount? I mean, tell me, oh wise ones (this is especially directed at Beast since he often states his opinions as if they are fact), what is the proper length (in terms of time or text) and what specific content has to be included (and how should it be presented) for a legitimate negative review of the PT films is neither too long, nor too short as to not get the point across, while also being a legit perspective and not "fanboy whining?"

I mean, if someone simply were to post "The PT sucks!"... you would call that fanboy whining (I'm pretty sure that you probably have at some point or another). But when it's too long, you also call it fanboy whining. I mean, what is the magic number? Is there a point where you go, "Well, I was going to give this reviewer some crap as a whiney fanboy, but his video review was 6 minutes and 37.5 seconds on the dot... the exact proper length! AND very insightful! Good for him!"

Let's face it, there won't be.


If you don't want to watch the videos, that's fine. I don't completely blame you in the sense that you like the PT, and spending that much time watching something that speaks poorly of it is not something that you want to do. I get that... again, that's fine. But if you aren't going to watch them, then you HAVE TO come to terms with the fact that you are in no position what-so-ever to pass judgment on them. So, just don't speak of them one way or the other.



And I would love to see Beast do a video (regardless of length) bashing to Nolan Batman films. If 8,000 people would even bother watching it, I guarantee that they sure as well wouldn't be "liking" it.

[Sith]

Originally Posted by STARKILLER--1138

Not much whining anyone can do with their head chopped off. And, you're right. Anakin "did not show the same kind of emotion that Luke showed." Hence, Anakin took it like a man while Luke whined like a *****.

Jedi always cry like a *****. It is there way.

[Uxi]

Originally Posted by longhornsgirl

The Yoda of the OT had a magical quality to him and was there to teach us about the force.

Nah, that's just the nostalgia.

[Jay444]

Originally Posted by Dynamo of Eternia

"And I would love to see Beast do a video (regardless of length) bashing to Nolan Batman films. If 8,000 people would even bother watching it, I guarantee that they sure as well wouldn't be "liking" it.

I too question Beast's film tastes. He doesn't like the Godfather or the Nolan Batman films, yet defends a film trilogy largley seen as inferior to his dying breath? However, and I cannot believe I am about to write this: I have to respect the guy. He does defend himself and despite what a lot of us may think; I don't feel he is writing some things out of spite or lack of intelligence (like a few others whom will remain nameless, just not worth the effort). He may have his moments (Mother****er mention Darth Maul one more time....) but we all get a little caught up. Beast is okay in comparison to a few others and I don't mind his opinions.

As far as sitting through that review, its like going on a date. You can sit with someone for 4 or 5 minutes and KNOW: "This isn't for me..." I am pretty sure forcing someone (i.e. Beast) whom LOVES the PT to watch something that points out all its flaws is NOT fun for him. He loves those movies and there is no amount of reviews or opinions that is going to change that. Within 5 minutes of that 4 hour review Beast knows it is going to offend him or make him feel inferior in some way. He doesn't have to sit through that at all. That is the great thing about entertainment, if you don't like it, you can turn it off. I do that with the PT all the time...

Oh, but make no mistake. Beast, like the rest of us, is a fanboy through and through.

[Sith]

Originally Posted by Dynamo of Eternia

And I would love to see Beast do a video (regardless of length) bashing to Nolan Batman films. If 8,000 people would even bother watching it, I guarantee that they sure as well wouldn't be "liking" it.

I'd take the PT over Nolan's Batman films anyday of the week.

That being said, I would find it hard to trust anyone's opinion who doesn't like The Godfather.

[kamphausd1]

Originally Posted by Jay444

I too question Beast's film tastes. He doesn't like the Godfather or the Nolan Batman films, yet defends a film trilogy largley seen as inferior to his dying breath? However, and I cannot believe I am about to write this: I have to respect the guy. He does defend himself and despite what a lot of us may think; I don't feel he is writing some things out of spite or lack of intelligence (like a few others whom will remain nameless, just not worth the effort). He may have his moments (Mother****er mention Darth Maul one more time....) but we all get a little caught up. Beast is okay in comparison to a few others and I don't mind his opinions.

As far as sitting through that review, its like going on a date. You can sit with someone for 4 or 5 minutes and KNOW: "This isn't for me..." I am pretty sure forcing someone (i.e. Beast) whom LOVES the PT to watch something that points out all its flaws is NOT fun for him. He loves those movies and there is no amount of reviews or opinions that is going to change that. Within 5 minutes of that 4 hour review Beast knows it is going to offend him or make him feel inferior in some way. He doesn't have to sit through that at all. That is the great thing about entertainment, if you don't like it, you can turn it off. I do that with the PT all the time...

Oh, but make no mistake. Beast, like the rest of us, is a fanboy through and through.

Very well said. But it's not so much that Beast might have questionable tastes or opinions that differ so much from other people. I mean you're right, everybody is entitled to their own opinion, have to respect that. But like Dynamo said, what's annoying sometimes is just the way he often smugly makes his opinions seem like they're absolute undeniable fact and tries to make everybody else seem like they're opinions and feelings on a certain matter are meaningless and aren't worth a damn at all. Maybe it's not intended on his part and maybe he doesn't mean to sound like that, but unfortunately it just comes across like that many times.

And yeah, he doesn't have to sit through the reviews at all if he thinks they're going to offend him, nothing wrong with that either. But, if I may borrow from Dynamo again, he's in no position to just dismiss them as nothing but mindless fanboy ravings done by a guy who lives in his parents basement when they're actually done by a very intelligent and creative independent filmmaker who maintains his own residence in Milwaukee (especially if he's only seen a few minutes of the reviews at best).

But that was a very good point you made about him in comparison to the other posters though. I mean yeah, Beast is absolutely nothing compared to people on here like Starkiller (I'm sure he was one of the ones you were refering to)

[greg_achen]

I say this with love because obviously I am somewhat of a nerd to be posting in this forum to begin with, let alone getting into debates about Star Wars. But often times when reading posts in this thread I am reminded of a particular exchange from a Simpsons episode...



Good times. lol

[kamphausd1]

Originally Posted by greg_achen

I say this with love because obviously I am somewhat of a nerd to be posting in this forum to begin with, let alone getting into debates about Star Wars. But often times when reading posts in this thread I am reminded of a particular exchange from a Simpsons episode...



Good times. lol

Heh.

[Bluyoda]

Originally Posted by kamphausd1

And yeah, he doesn't have to sit through the reviews at all if he thinks they're going to offend him, nothing wrong with that either. But, if I may borrow from Dynamo again, he's in no position to just dismiss them as nothing but mindless fanboy ravings done by a guy who lives in his parents basement when they're actually done by a very intelligent and creative independent filmmaker who maintains his own residence in Milwaukee (especially if he's only seen a few minutes of the reviews at best).

Don't you think that's stretching it a "bit" far? Come on, that guy is a hopeless jerk, and cannot possibly be taken seriously.
Nigh said.

Originally Posted by greg_achen

I say this with love because obviously I am somewhat of a nerd to be posting in this forum to begin with, let alone getting into debates about Star Wars. But often times when reading posts in this thread I am reminded of a particular exchange from a Simpsons episode...


l

Spot on!

I too, take any SW episode over the Batman movies any day.
At least George Lucas has a sense of humor and wit.
Also, his movies are filled with warmth, have great messages, and radiate positivity, whereas Nolan's films are dark, hopeless, violent, psychotic ....

I really don't get all the love for TDK, despite the fact that the performances are excellent, the execution terrific, and music, but the feeling I get from it is similar to The Godfather: Gosh, what an awful world we live in!
I guess people in this cynical world prefer negativity ....

But that's neither here nor there.

[P@t_Mtl]

Not liking The Godfather as nothing to do about knowing or having bad taste in cinema. The Godfather is far from being the greatest movie ever made. I just love how the fans of this movie try to sound so superior because they love and understand The Godfather

Let see! Why I don't like The Godfather?

1. I do not enjoy gangster movies, never did and never will. The only time I will grant a gangster movie a break is if Humphrey Bogart is in it.

2. I really don't like any of the actors in the movie. I know I will be flamed by the cinema expert of The Godfather but I do not consider Pacino or Brando to be gods of acting. I hope you can all sleep tonight knowing this

3. I really do not enjoy the style of directing of Francis Ford Coppola.

Three strikes, your out!!!!!

Now where the difference is, I don't spend all my waking hours on the Internet forums making posts about my dislike of The Godfather unlike others who seem to have a serious fixation on the prequels

[Ryan0503]

Originally Posted by JamesKurtovich

They had to earn the name "Star Wars" somehow. What better way than to take well known stuff about the movies and "upgrade" them (Lucas style)? Obvious that the success of the PT relied heavily on the first trilogy.

I like how the strongest characters in the OT, Sidious and Yoda, don't need to perform flips or pull out sabers to convince the viewer they are incredibly powerful. RLM reviewer said something along the lines of, "We had a wise old Yoda who taught us about the Force and now we have a cartoony CGI Yoda that does video game shit." I lol'd.

This was one of my biggest problems with the PT!!! I know a lot of people here do not allow EU discussion here, but in the Tales of the Jedi comic, when a Jedi reached a certain level of mastery in the force he would disconnect his power source from his lightsaber. I always thought that Yoda and Palpatine didn't have lightsabers because they were so powerful they didn't need to. Even Palpatine in ROTJ talks about Lukes lightsaber like it's a kids toy (when refering to his "Jedi Weapon"), and Yoda in ESB telling Luke he wouldn't need it in the cave. Maybe I'm the only one that took it like that but I just got the sence in the OT that using a lightsaber was beneth Yoda and Palpatine.

Oh and just so everyone knows my certain point of view ... I love the SAGA, I grew up on the original versions of the OT, and wish they would be included on the blu-ray release, but it's not gonna stop me from buying as I've bought every Star Wars release. Han shot first and Jar Jar is funny!!!

[ObiTrentKenobi]

Originally Posted by NYorker

About Alec Guinness, he enjoyed doing it, but when he saw how obsessive the fans became...he did not want to have more to do with it, so his role was reduced to mainly "force ghost" appearances.

His appearances of "force ghost kenobi" had nothing to do with how he felt about the fans...

From The Making of Star Wars: The Definitive Story (2007) (awesome book); and The Making of Empire Strikes Back: The Definitive Story (2010) (awesome book and extremely expensive)

1. While shooting the film (anh), Lucas decided to kill off Kenobi at the last minute - because after the Vader/Kenobi lightsaber fight Kenobi didn't have anything to do... he would just be "there" without much dialogue or action. So instead of escaping the fight, Lucas decided to add drama by having him killed by Vader

2. Guinness was upset that he was going to be killed off when Lucas told him the new plan - he wanted a bigger role

3. When Empire Strikes Back came around - Lucas didn't know if Kenobi could come back or not (an idea of maybe Kenobi really didn't die somehow). He came up with the "force ghost" idea.

4. Kirschner and Lucas planned for months into filmmaking Empire wether or not Guinness would do the small "ghost" role or not. It may not have even been in the films at all (that decision to even have the "force ghost" wasn't decided upon until filming was almost done! Then it was presented to Guinness for the first time over dinner with Guinness, Lucas and Kirschner)

5. Lucas/kirschner got Guinness to agree to the part - and Guinness accepted fairly easily

6. The problem though? Guinness was very sick. He couldn't be in light very long because it hurt his eyes and gave him headaches. But he finished his filming in one day - and was very dedicated to the role (as any great actor is).

7. Kirschner said (in making of ESB:def story.....) that Guinness sat between takes reading the dialogue and making notes to himself in his script, and suggesting other ways to the director that lines could be delivered.

Can't wait until Making of Return of the Jedi!!! probably won't come out until 2013, since the other 2 books came out for the 30 year anniversaries

[Ryan0503]

I seem to remember that Obi-Wan was supposed to be the Yoda of the Trilogy but since Lucas thought he could only make one movie he had him killed off thus having to create Yoda as the mentor in ESB. I think he talks about it in the DVD Special Features but I cant say for sure.

[Beast]

Yeah, Alec Guiness didn't turn into a huge ass about the role until years later.