The Matrix 4K UHD (1999)

[bbwiscfan]

Originally Posted by Nothing371

I think people are vastly overestimating the reach of this disc's influence. We also only care about it because it turned out fantastic. Everyone I have mentioned 'The Matrix' to so far gives an "are you kidding?" type of response or "I had to look twice at the pile of movies when I thought you were suggesting we watch The Matrix". The $9.99 collection of three movies on blu-ray is also sitting right over there on the next shelf at Best Buy. 9 out of 10 people that are actively at the store buying movies don't even care about this version of The Matrix. "Why would I buy that when I can have all three of them for ten bucks?"

The market for this kind of thing is insanely smaller than many people on here might think.

I'm not arguing with that the stock on this title was severely under-supplied. It was. But WB wasn't really wrong in their assumptions with their supply management either.

Great post. Agree completely. I think the fact that Best Buys, for example, have a section of UHD separate from the rest of the movies is something we should be grateful for to begin with because I never thought they would have a section like that when UHD's came out. Think about it, aside from BB, in terms of a walk in store, Target and Walmart's really don't have a section at all for 4K. They are usually scattered about and more difficult to find. And in terms of the market, you're spot on. I walk in and I still see DVD's as the dominate disc available to purchase, not even blu-rays, DVDS! It's absolutely maddening to still see this in 2018 yet here we are because that's the reality. And yes, UHDs are a small market, which only makes CATALOGUE titles even harder to find.

I had the same problem with Blade Runner UHD back in September, but eventually after a couple of months there was ample supply; I have no doubt The Matrix will follow suit. In the end, while this is frustrating and yes, the studios maybe could put out some more product, its the way it is. I'm just grateful at this point we are getting any UHDs we can and that disc media lasts as long as it possibly can.

[aetherhole]

It depends on the locations for the non-Best Buy stores, like Target or Wal-mart. I know the several nearest to me have dedicated UHD sections (albeit relatively small). I guess here in Orange County, CA we have a lot of big spenders that make it worthwhile enough.

[LordoftheRings]

Originally Posted by fighthefutureofhd

Smaller than Kate Moss' waistline.

She's in The Matrix?

[LordoftheRings]

North America is a very small market for 3D and 4K Blus.
The UK is bigger, and more thirsty artistically advanced wise.
Europeans are better wired, sophisticated, tasteful in their art culture and entertainment.
North Americans are more news oriented, football and basketball.

But I do agree that if you want The Matrix in 4K, online is best.
I also agree that here in North America 4K is a very small niche, a fart in the bucket.
There's no use to provide large supplies when there's no demands.
Case in point...3D, and now slowly fading 4K and Disney.

Here the money is in the movie theaters, and in China's theaters.

[fighthefutureofhd]

Originally Posted by LordoftheRings

She's in The Matrix?

Yes, but she's so thin you can't see her.

[LoSouL]

Originally Posted by LordoftheRings

She's in The Matrix?

[tyrok]

Well my store just got its first actual shipment of this today (not from the Father's Day shipper). So there is hope.

[Bourne1886]

Originally Posted by LordoftheRings

North America is a very small market for 3D and 4K Blus.
The UK is bigger, and more thirsty artistically advanced wise.
Europeans are better wired, sophisticated, tasteful in their art culture and entertainment.
North Americans are more news oriented, football and basketball.

But I do agree that if you want The Matrix in 4K, online is best.
I also agree that here in North America 4K is a very small niche, a fart in the bucket.
There's no use to provide large supplies when there's no demands.
Case in point...3D, and now slowly fading 4K and Disney.

Here the money is in the movie theaters, and in China's theaters.

But the thing is there is greater choice in America and a lot cheaper than the U.K. I import a lot because you can’t always get what you want here in the U.K and secondly we don’t fair well when it comes to bonus features and digital copies. To me in my mind America has it better. I thought that maybe because there was a shortage of The Matrix on 4K that there was more of a Demand as there are more consumers in America?

[LettuceJUMP]

Originally Posted by Nothing371

I think people are vastly overestimating the reach of this disc's influence. We also only care about it because it turned out fantastic. Everyone I have mentioned 'The Matrix' to so far gives an "are you kidding?" type of response or "I had to look twice at the pile of movies when I thought you were suggesting we watch The Matrix". The $9.99 collection of three movies on blu-ray is also sitting right over there on the next shelf at Best Buy. 9 out of 10 people that are actively at the store buying movies don't even care about this version of The Matrix. "Why would I buy that when I can have all three of them for ten bucks?"

The market for this kind of thing is insanely smaller than many people on here might think.

I'm not arguing with that the stock on this title was severely under-supplied. It was. But WB wasn't really wrong in their assumptions with their supply management either.

Well said. I wish it wasn't true. Us 4K UHD lovers on the forums make up maybe a couple percent of people buying movies. Very few will care if it is 4K or UHD, if they can get the whole trilogy for half the price. Even 5-10 years, UHD may never reach the market share that dvd and Blu-ray had at their peaks. The difference from Blu-ray to UHD is not enough to make the average person spend more. But for me, I want to squeeze every bit as close to film as I can. I'll line up for 8K. And probably pay $40 a disc when they come. LOL

[y2jman]

Originally Posted by tyrok

Well my store just got its first actual shipment of this today (not from the Father's Day shipper). So there is hope.

do you think that there is very good possibility that they might get this back in stock online shipped to house maybe sunday or next week, week after perhaps

[Leterface]

Originally Posted by LettuceJUMP

Well said. I wish it wasn't true. Us 4K UHD lovers on the forums make up maybe a couple percent of people buying movies. Very few will care if it is 4K or UHD, if they can get the whole trilogy for half the price. Even 5-10 years, UHD may never reach the market share that dvd and Blu-ray had at their peaks. The difference from Blu-ray to UHD is not enough to make the average person spend more. But for me, I want to squeeze every bit as close to film as I can. I'll line up for 8K. And probably pay $40 a disc when they come. LOL

Well said too, but the industry can keep trying for years and years if there is a profit and maby a day the general public get it, I think if not a quite good amount of the potential customer would have gotten into BD then ofcourse the studios wouldn't think that either. I think if they just keep knockin with UHD then eventually they will success with it if they have the powers to deliver enough.

[LordoftheRings]

Originally Posted by Bourne1886

But the thing is there is greater choice in America and a lot cheaper than the U.K. I import a lot because you can’t always get what you want here in the U.K and secondly we don’t fair well when it comes to bonus features and digital copies. To me in my mind America has it better. I thought that maybe because there was a shortage of The Matrix on 4K that there was more of a Demand as there are more consumers in America?

There's nothing we can do regarding prices from different countries.
And today if we want wider exposure to products we want we have to go global.

The Matrix 4K Blu is worth getting no matter the price, no matter where we get it from.

Tomb Raider 4K Blu and 3D Blu is a totally different affair, regardless of top picture and sound. It's best for hardcore fans, me excluded.

This is my onion, I mean opinion.

[bbwiscfan]

And saw three copies of the matrix sitting there, so it seems like Tyrok said that there is new supply out there for the $18.99 price.

[Geoff D]

Originally Posted by LettuceJUMP

Well said. I wish it wasn't true. Us 4K UHD lovers on the forums make up maybe a couple percent of people buying movies. Very few will care if it is 4K or UHD, if they can get the whole trilogy for half the price. Even 5-10 years, UHD may never reach the market share that dvd and Blu-ray had at their peaks. The difference from Blu-ray to UHD is not enough to make the average person spend more. But for me, I want to squeeze every bit as close to film as I can. I'll line up for 8K. And probably pay $40 a disc when they come. LOL

People keep saying "well said" but why are all the indie distributors (there's a lot of 'em!) releasing all this cult/arthouse/schlock/foreign/whatever stuff on blu-ray like there's no tomorrow? Because, just like 4K UHD, a niche market is still a market and if you can position yourself to target that audience then you can still make money from them, maybe not a lot of money (you'll have to debase yourself with more 'populist' fayre to get to the obscure stuff you really want to do) but there's a reason why 4K disc is starting to ramp up nicely: it's because people are buying it (or rather wanting to buy it but can't in the case of [insert poorly stocked Warners movie here] ) in spite of the bargain basement Blu-ray version that's sitting on an adjacent shelf.

I see the logic there to "who would buy a 4K like this?" but not the reality, which is that 4K is a niche product that's aimed squarely at a niche section of the market so anyone who wants the specific 4K release isn't going to walk out of the store with the Blu-ray version in their hands, no matter how cheap it may be. Well, not unless they can't find any stock of the 4K release...

And to think people were worrying about what 2018 would bring on UHD, my goodness.

[y2jman]

Originally Posted by bbwiscfan

And saw three copies of the matrix sitting there, so it seems like Tyrok said that there is new supply out there for the $18.99 price.

its a shame my sorry city doesn't have one I wonder when they come back online again shipped to house maybe sunday or 1 day next week hopefully its still 18.99 price


and I can go ahead cancel stupid amazon order that seems going to get until july 1-2 months shipped despite 1 day shipping 27.43 meh

don't try to order it amazon now however because its say shipped 1-3 months

i haven't cancel amazon i'm hoping at least it get back in stock online best buy so I can order shipped to home pretty soon cheap that is

I dread order it bullmoose 31.97 but with waiting game amazon wanting to see might get movie next week or week after is slim to none

if best buy gets in stock this weekend shipped to house 2 day shipping and get it by june everything will be good that is price is still 18.99

never will I once again order something amazon and it saids usually shipped 1 to 2 months which now changed 1-3 months shipped blah

[LettuceJUMP]

Originally Posted by Geoff D

People keep saying "well said" but why are all the indie distributors (there's a lot of 'em!) releasing all this cult/arthouse/schlock/foreign/whatever stuff on blu-ray like there's no tomorrow? Because, just like 4K UHD, a niche market is still a market and if you can position yourself to target that audience then you can still make money from them, maybe not a lot of money (you'll have to debase yourself with more 'populist' fayre to get to the obscure stuff you really want to do) but there's a reason why 4K disc is starting to ramp up nicely: it's because people are buying it (or rather wanting to buy it but can't in the case of [insert poorly stocked Warners movie here] ) in spite of the bargain basement Blu-ray version that's sitting on an adjacent shelf.

I see the logic there to "who would buy a 4K like this?" but not the reality, which is that 4K is a niche product that's aimed squarely at a niche section of the market so anyone who wants the specific 4K release isn't going to walk out of the store with the Blu-ray version in their hands, no matter how cheap it may be. Well, not unless they can't find any stock of the 4K release...

And to think people were worrying about what 2018 would bring on UHD, my goodness.

Like usual, I tend to agree with you Geoff. My curiosity makes me think a few things. 1) what is the cost to release a 4k release of an older catalog film, including resoration etc. 2) how many copies do they need to sell to deem successful uhd release. 3) what kind of numbers do new releases do vs catalog uhd’s in sales (i would assume people are buying more new releases on uhd 4k to future proof, but less on things they might already own) etc etc. These are questions i have often wondered regarding these releases. Last Jedi and Tomb Raider probably do fine, and they have to do very little in studio to prep for 4k as most of these movies are shot in 4k or can easily be converted but it must be a larger investment to take a saving private ryan, men in black or braveheart. Back to the topic, Matrix was a gamechanger on dvd, I’m sure sold well on blu-ray. But I wonder what the risk vs reward was to restore and release on 4k.

[Nothing371]

Originally Posted by Geoff D

And to think people were worrying about what 2018 would bring on UHD, my goodness.

The 4K UHD section at my Best Buy just keeps getting bigger and bigger. Also, most of it is on sale this week too. There are four large sectionals on the main wall, more UHDs mixed in with the inner sections of the feature wall, and they are also scattered across the endcaps, the sales shippers, the front boat, and then there is a small display in the television area as well. It's great to see UHDs expanding at this rate. It felt stagnant for most of last year but now its finally hitting its stride.

The smaller Best Buy stores with the smaller media sections consisting of just a couple of aisles still have the same amount of sectionals for 4K UHD which is also a good thing to see. Other media is getting phased out in favor of niche 4K UHD. I mean someone has to give people a little push, right?

Unfortunately when you go to lesser, more casual and mainstream electronics retailers like Target and Walmart, the bourgeoisie is still buying incredible amounts of DVDs, and some blu rays. The BDs have even been scaled back in order to accommodate more DVDs for these peasants. It's a crying shame. Just because Joe Blow hasn't wanted to spend fifty dollars on a blu ray player for the last ten years. People are so resistant to change it's sickening. Even the media supervisor at my flagship Best Buy still buys several DVDs every month. He's so obstinate and stuck in his ways. I'll never understand how someone can be that big of a fan of movies, and the Oscars, and not give a crap about the quality of a visual presentation even in the slightest. These people are everywhere, and they need a push. I don't know why the retailers are being so accommodating to them instead of stocking newer products. The obvious answer is that profit margins must be larger for them on DVDs.

[Geoff D]

Originally Posted by LettuceJUMP

Like usual, I tend to agree with you Geoff. My curiosity makes me think a few things. 1) what is the cost to release a 4k release of an older catalog film, including resoration etc. 2) how many copies do they need to sell to deem successful uhd release. 3) what kind of numbers do new releases do vs catalog uhd’s in sales (i would assume people are buying more new releases on uhd 4k to future proof, but less on things they might already own) etc etc. These are questions i have often wondered regarding these releases. Last Jedi and Tomb Raider probably do fine, and they have to do very little in studio to prep for 4k as most of these movies are shot in 4k or can easily be converted but it must be a larger investment to take a saving private ryan, men in black or braveheart. Back to the topic, Matrix was a gamechanger on dvd, I’m sure sold well on blu-ray. But I wonder what the risk vs reward was to restore and release on 4k.

It's not cheap to go back to a film's negative and transfer/stabilise/clean/repair/colour time it all from scratch in the digital realm, easily in the five figure range and the price only goes up from there depending on what work has to be done. And yet we've had Paramount do exactly that with two of the titles you've mentioned (SPR and Braveheart) because clearly they feel that the market is there to support such work as they damned sure ain't doing it for free (though 4K remasters also have long-term uses outside of physical media, e.g. updated theatrical DCP, streaming etc).

I've said it before that if you put the work in then people will pay for it and those packages for SPR & Coeur Vaillant have it all: true 4K remasters from negative, Dolby Vision, Dolby Atmos, original Blu-ray release inc. extras disc, they even comes with a slipcase for Christ's sake! What more could we want? And just as the indies are somehow making all these 4K remasters pay off for them (just look at Shout returning to the well with something like Lifeforce), albeit not on physical 4K disc just yet, I see no reason why 4K disc can't be part of that same bracket. Small scale doesn't mean no profits, and UHD's higher price bracket means that you can have less people buying it but still have a comparative amount of gross income (think of it like the Twilight Time model, heck, Warners even make their UHD catalogue releases limited edition, or at least it can feel that way for folks in the US).

As for MiB that was simply another day at the office for Sony, they can do these in their sleep. They keep on putting out freshly remastered film-finished goodness and have been from the start of their involvement with UHD disc, this from a company that wrote down millions of dollars of losses on Blu-ray just a few years back and yet they're continually pumping out these glorious 35mm remasters for us to enjoy. If people ain't buying them then Sony must have one hell of a dumb home video department to persist in remastering all this stuff and releasing them on 4K.

[bbwiscfan]

Originally Posted by Geoff D

It's not cheap to go back to a film's negative and transfer/stabilise/clean/repair/colour time it all from scratch in the digital realm, easily in the five figure range and the price only goes up from there depending on what work has to be done. And yet we've had Paramount do exactly that with two of the titles you've mentioned (SPR and Braveheart) because clearly they feel that the market is there to support such work as they damned sure ain't doing it for free (though 4K remasters also have long-term uses outside of physical media, e.g. updated theatrical DCP, streaming etc).

I've said it before that if you put the work in then people will pay for it and those packages for SPR & Coeur Vaillant have it all: true 4K remasters from negative, Dolby Vision, Dolby Atmos, original Blu-ray release inc. extras disc, they even comes with a slipcase for Christ's sake! What more could we want? And just as the indies are somehow making all these 4K remasters pay off for them (just look at Shout returning to the well with something like Lifeforce), albeit not on physical 4K disc just yet, I see no reason why 4K disc can't be part of that same bracket. Small scale doesn't mean no profits, and UHD's higher price bracket means that you can have less people buying it but still have a comparative amount of gross income (think of it like the Twilight Time model, heck, Warners even make their UHD catalogue releases limited edition, or at least it can feel that way for folks in the US).

As for MiB that was simply another day at the office for Sony, they can do these in their sleep. They keep on putting out freshly remastered film-finished goodness and have been from the start of their involvement with UHD disc, this from a company that wrote down millions of dollars of losses on Blu-ray just a few years back and yet they're continually pumping out these glorious 35mm remasters for us to enjoy. If people ain't buying them then Sony must have one hell of a dumb home video department to persist in remastering all this stuff and releasing them on 4K.

Those MIB discs are so flipping glorious, it isn’t even funny. Just rewatched them again and can’t get enough, especially that third film. Just jaw dropping.

[bbwiscfan]

Originally Posted by Nothing371

The 4K UHD section at my Best Buy just keeps getting bigger and bigger. Also, most of it is on sale this week too. There are four large sectionals on the main wall, more UHDs mixed in with the inner sections of the feature wall, and they are also scattered across the endcaps, the sales shippers, the front boat, and then there is a small display in the television area as well. It's great to see UHDs expanding at this rate. It felt stagnant for most of last year but now its finally hitting its stride.

The smaller Best Buy stores with the smaller media sections consisting of just a couple of aisles still have the same amount of sectionals for 4K UHD which is also a good thing to see. Other media is getting phased out in favor of niche 4K UHD. I mean someone has to give people a little push, right?

Unfortunately when you go to lesser, more casual and mainstream electronics retailers like Target and Walmart, the bourgeoisie is still buying incredible amounts of DVDs, and some blu rays. The BDs have even been scaled back in order to accommodate more DVDs for these peasants. It's a crying shame. Just because Joe Blow hasn't wanted to spend fifty dollars on a blu ray player for the last ten years. People are so resistant to change it's sickening. Even the media supervisor at my flagship Best Buy still buys several DVDs every month. He's so obstinate and stuck in his ways. I'll never understand how someone can be that big of a fan of movies, and the Oscars, and not give a crap about the quality of a visual presentation even in the slightest. These people are everywhere, and they need a push. I don't know why the retailers are being so accommodating to them instead of stocking newer products. The obvious answer is that profit margins must be larger for them on DVDs.

That media supervisor, that’s just sad.....should be a crime . My brother in law is in our boat with quality, he won’t even touch a DVD. Flat out won’t watch it unless it’s HD. I applaud him.