Batman: 4-Film Collection 4K UHDs (1989-1997)

[Agent Kay]

So it's not the first 5.1 mix but it's a down mix???? Are they kidding????

[epicfilmguys]

Yeah I’ll chime in to ask the same question again. So no old soundmix included on the UHD disc of 89? It does just a downmix of the revisionist Atmos track?

[Geoff D]

Originally Posted by Maxwell Everett

I think Mr. Harris is just acknowledging that most of these films were shot at night or on stages with high-speed (400 or 500 ASA) color negative film that had a resolving power of around 100 lines per millimeter. So naturally, being 1.85:1 productions, that means a projection aperture of 20.96mm x 11.33mm, so that's around 2096x1133 digital equivalent. 2K Roughly.

Any daylight (100 ASA) stuff would be around 160 lines/mm, so about 3.3K.

Of course, nothing wrong with oversampling what's there. Might as well.

I recall someone saying about the Taxi Driver restoration that it also topped out at about 3K...but we know this about 35mm film. It hits 4K at best with an oversampled transfer on the slowest stock with the fullest 4-perf aperture on the best glass with a nice thick exposure on a non-moving test card, but that's no reason to not want any 2K+ information that has been captured on real-world negative, not to mention bypassing older BDs which may have been transferred from interpositive (which itself will instantly steal something like 20% of available resolution) or have had filtering/iffy compression of their own.

I'm not arguing with you Maxwell, you know your shizzle, but that kind of blasé comment from RAH does nobody any favours. This is the same person who lauded the original BD of The Dark Knight in his Nolan 4K assessment, for example. Yes, I've made my distaste for the processing on the Nolan titles well known but that TDK 4K still dumps on the janky old BD from the top of Wayne Tower.

[PowellPressburger]

Just reminds me I still very much want Sony to release Taxi Driver on 4K! Really surprised they have not already.

[IndyMLVC]

Originally Posted by jonam

What he means to say is that the 5.1 lossy mix included on these new discs is just a down mix of the new Atmos tinkered mix and not the original Theatrical mix included on the older blu ray from 10 years ago.

What's the "below comment" he's referring to??

Originally Posted by DMRI2006

EDIT - this 5.1 isn't the old 5.1 after all. See below comment for clarification

[Geoff D]

Yeh, there is no 'below' comment about the audio. A deleted post perhaps?

[ROSS.T.G.]

Would have liked the original audio to have been included it’s not a deal breaker for me.

[OutOfBoose]

UHD or not, quality present day OCN transfers look massively better than average stuff from 10 years ago.

[epicfilmguys]

If the original audio isn’t included this is a pass for me. Watching the new transfer in theaters with all of those awful modern sound effects shoved into a movie that they don’t belong in almost made me leave the theater.

[DJJez]

Originally Posted by epicfilmguys

If the original audio isn’t included this is a pass for me. Watching the new transfer in theaters with all of those awful modern sound effects shoved into a movie that they don’t belong in almost made me leave the theater.

then its a pass for you cause it isnt included lol

[epicfilmguys]

Originally Posted by DJJez

then its a pass for you cause it isnt included lol

I guess your crystal ball predicted that. Thanks for your insight oh great one.

[DMRI2006]

Originally Posted by Geoff D

Yeh, there is no 'below' comment about the audio. A deleted post perhaps?

Yeah I was trying to re-edit my post on the way to bed and got fouled up, then deleted it and thought I'd try again this AM (lol).

What I was trying to say is that I spent a little time bouncing back between the Atmos and 5.1 Dolby Digital tracks on the BATMAN UHD and granted I only watched the first 30 minutes. It does seem to me the 5.1 is a folddown/what have you of the Atmos track. The extra "push" you hear on the gunshots in the Atmos mix are on the 5.1 track as well. So purists who need the original mix, it's not on here.

The thing with the gunshots is that they're not all replaced, it's like they laid some new FX on top of the older ones. This is especially evident in the early warehouse scene. If you put the foreign language tracks on, you can hear the really old "whizz bang" gunshots that were straight out of a '50s western. In the Atmos mix, they're there audibly a little, but mostly buried under the new work.

Curiously, the scene where Joker offs Palance, it doesn't sound like they replaced the gunshots at all -- that old "library" gunshot effect is still there in the Atmos mix. So someone is going to have to catalogue these differences (not me! lol) because it had been years since I saw the film, and I thought the Atmos track was engaging and effective, and not out of place necessarily.

It doesn't seem like a radical, really noticeable remix like the SUPERMAN one -- yet for the folks, the purists, who want the straight original audio, it's not here.

[epicfilmguys]

Are the audio tracks identical for the “remastered in 4K” 1080p blu’s that come with the UHD?

[Brian81]

Originally Posted by epicfilmguys

If the original audio isn’t included this is a pass for me. Watching the new transfer in theaters with all of those awful modern sound effects shoved into a movie that they don’t belong in almost made me leave the theater.

Same here. I can deal with a surround remix using the original soundtrack, but once you start replacing the original effects, it's all over for me. There has been a shitstorm about The Terminator, I wonder how it will be about this one. Guessing not as much, as these films aren't as highly regarded as that one. It's a shame that the BDs look barely better than the DVDs. How many will care more about eye candy than original intent.


Though I guess I've made exceptions, myself - for Disney animation. Really don't have much choice, almost everything is altered - even for something like Aladdin where the original VHS/LD release was altered.

[DMRI2006]

Originally Posted by epicfilmguys

Are the audio tracks identical for the “remastered in 4K” 1080p blu’s that come with the UHD?

Yes, it's the same configuration on the Blu-Ray.

[TPerryoo7]

Originally Posted by slimdude

This doesn't make any sense at all! Why buy the individual releases, if you're going to sell them shortly thereafter in the first place.

I buy the movies on disc to watch them. I don’t bother with the digital renting nonsense. These movies are extremely important to me, they aren’t just random “catalogue titles” for a collection. I’m actually watching these on June 4th. I’ve been waiting on them for a very long time.

Now, the steelbook set actually comes out in September, it doesn’t release at the same time as the individual releases. So obviously this is very frustrating to me, that I have to do this to get what I want. The steel set will be of cheaper cost than buying all the singles together, so the loss I take selling the singles a few months later isn’t bad at all (since I will have used them and watched them several times by then anyway). I want the steelbook set as the packaging for these movies, not the ugly white slipcover singles. I wish I didn’t have to buy the singles just to watch them and then later sell them for the actual set I want, but it’s something that I’m gonna have to put up with.

I’ve double dipped just for packaging several times, and sold my old versions (as long as the disc content is the same). As I’m sure hundreds of members here do haha. This is nothing new.

So what doesn't make sense? My impatience? Well that’s just a personal problem that anyone could understand. I’m sure you're impatient with certain things in life.

Originally Posted by drawn

After comparing the museum rescue scene to identical clips on YouTube, the difference in the audio seem subtle to me. Sure, it's a little different... but subtle.

Batman (1989) - Flugelheim Museum Rescue (4K Remaster) - YouTube

Not so subtle to me. It sounds like poopy ass drippings right into my ear holes.

[Fat Phil]

Originally Posted by TPerryoo7

Not so subtle to me. It sounds like poopy ass drippings right into my ear holes.

[OutOfBoose]

It's certainly not subtle, but I'll probably end up just watching this version over and over again without care. Like I did in case of The Terminator. Unfortunate they're adding stuff that wasn't there in 1989 without providing the original stuff, but what can we do...

[HeavyHitter]

Originally Posted by OutOfBoose

UHD or not, quality present day OCN transfers look massively better than average stuff from 10 years ago.

It's probably closer to 15 years ago as I think the original transfers stem from the DVD release.

[Agent Kay]

Originally Posted by drawn

After comparing the museum rescue scene to identical clips on YouTube, the difference in the audio seem subtle to me. Sure, it's a little different... but subtle.

Notice the blast coming out of the Batmobile's muffler at around the 0:57 mark on the new 1080p disc sounds more like a fiery furnace coming alive instead of a loud boomin' jet plane.

Batman (1989) - Flugelheim Museum Rescue (4K Remaster) - YouTube

I like what I'm hearing (so far) and still look forward to experiencing it fully on my proper setup.

Shame it was an actual jet engine then....