Sony:* ‬21* ‬Million PS3*‬s Sold Worldwide !

[SkantDragon]

I think it's an easy guess that the PS3 will be seeing a price drop.

They've already extended it going into last christmas at the same price point. They're not going to go another year. And if they can reach down as low as $299, their sales are really going to take off. Especially now that they've gotten their other ducks in a row.

In fact, I tend to think that's all part of the plan. Sony is sitting on top of a lot of potential energy here which they've been carefully setting up.

[Darkhawk9587]

Good job Sony. Hoping more will utilize the power of the PS3 when the price drop occurs.

[Uncle Leo]

Yes 2 of mine crapped out and I am responsible for 3 of them!!!

[AM-MAN]

Good numbers by any standard.

[bampot]

Originally Posted by Maxpower1987

I had a look and 21.3m sell through is wrong, I don't know which countries they are counting and what data they are using, but it doesn't match up with anything I can see. I can't get more detailed than that, but PS3 sell-through is under 21m and by a fair amount too. Unless GfK are giving Sony data I can't see (which is very unlikely) this is the shipped figure to the end of December 2008.

I expect WW shipments for the three months ending 31/3/09 to be quite a bit lower than expected, just enough for Sony to meet their fiscal target...

They're using there own data. Unless you're accusing Sony of fraud?. As of 31st of December 21.3million PS3's had been sold to retail ie 21.3million PS3's had been bought off Sony by other companies. Nintendo, Sony, Microsoft actually determining how many of there consoles are in the homes of people is impossible for them because there part in the eco-system ends when they sell to retail.

[bampot]

Originally Posted by SkantDragon

I think it's an easy guess that the PS3 will be seeing a price drop.

They've already extended it going into last christmas at the same price point. They're not going to go another year. And if they can reach down as low as $299, their sales are really going to take off. Especially now that they've gotten their other ducks in a row.

In fact, I tend to think that's all part of the plan. Sony is sitting on top of a lot of potential energy here which they've been carefully setting up.

It's extremely unlikely there'l be a PS3 pricedrop for the forseeable future. Sony like all Japanese exporters are being ripped to shreds by the Yen shock.

[xtop]

Originally Posted by bampot

As of 31st of December 21.3million PS3's had been sold to retail ie 21.3million PS3's had been bought off Sony by other companies.

thats what he's saying..

[Icemage]

Originally Posted by bampot

They're using there own data. Unless you're accusing Sony of fraud?. As of 31st of December 21.3million PS3's had been sold to retail ie 21.3million PS3's had been bought off Sony by other companies. Nintendo, Sony, Microsoft actually determining how many of there consoles are in the homes of people is impossible for them because there part in the eco-system ends when they sell to retail.

That's where firms like NPD and GfK come into play. No one cares how many consoles are sitting in stores. It's meaningless because they're not in use, and they're not selling software.

It is perfectly fair to point out that it is disingenuous to talk about shipped numbers - with or without the implication that those same units have already been sold through.

[SkantDragon]

Originally Posted by Icemage

That's where firms like NPD and GfK come into play. No one cares how many consoles are sitting in stores. It's meaningless because they're not in use, and they're not selling software.

It is perfectly fair to point out that it is disingenuous to talk about shipped numbers - with or without the implication that those same units have already been sold through.

I disagree. The problem is that NPD and GfK and anybody else can not accurately track end user sales. Their numbers are estimates. We tend to assume that they are 100% accurate, but they can't be. They have a lot of limitations in both accuracy and coverage.

Especially because NPD covers the US only. The 360 consistently appears to be beating the snot out of Sony because most people are only looking at NPD data, and NPD data covers only Microsoft's strongest showing.

By the metrics that most people are looking at, Sony is losing by a landslide. But it's something of a warped reality. They're not actually getting the whole picture. If that's really what was going on, you wouldn't be seeing Microsoft making such aggressive or even what some might call desperate moves to compete with the PS3.

Sony is very strong globally. And much of that strength is in areas which are not effectively tracked for the public by any organizations like NPD.

So in short, trying to track end user sales is a complicated mess who's accuracy leaves much to be desired. Shipped numbers, on the other hand, are much more easily tracked and reported. These are publically traded companies. They can't lie about those numbers without risking being nailed in audits.

Yes, these numbers lag behind end user sales. But they're highly representative of actual end user sales on a global level. Retailers aren't stupid. Their ordering habits are usually going to mirror actual sales rather closely.

Besides, we're comparing Sony's shipped numbers versus Microsoft's shipped numbers. There's really no more accurate statistic for comparing the two which we have access to. And those numbers say Sony is gaining. And that's well in line with the way both companies are actually behaving (all press statements and media commentary aside).

[Icemage]

Originally Posted by SkantDragon

I disagree. The problem is that NPD and GfK and anybody else can not accurately track end user sales. Their numbers are estimates. We tend to assume that they are 100% accurate, but they can't be. They have a lot of limitations in both accuracy and coverage.

A less than perfect estimate is nonetheless better than unrealistic expectation of every unit shipped being sold through to consumers. This is almost never true unless an item is currently in huge demand where it flies off the shelf (see the Nintento Wii circa 2007, and even that only lasted for a year or so).

Especially because NPD covers the US only. The 360 consistently appears to be beating the snot out of Sony because most people are only looking at NPD data, and NPD data covers only Microsoft's strongest showing.

NPD covers the US and Canada. GfK covers most of Europe and Australia/NZ. MediaCreate is fairly well regarded in Japan. Together, the three cover a fairly good chunk of the worldwide market.

By the metrics that most people are looking at, Sony is losing by a landslide. But it's something of a warped reality. They're not actually getting the whole picture. If that's really what was going on, you wouldn't be seeing Microsoft making such aggressive or even what some might call desperate moves to compete with the PS3.

Sony isn't really losing by a landslide, no. The PS3 is losing by a large margin in North America, but it's holding its own in Europe, and grinding the Xbox 360 into the dust in Japan despite everything Microsoft tries (and they are indeed trying pretty hard).

Sony is very strong globally. And much of that strength is in areas which are not effectively tracked for the public by any organizations like NPD.

Sony as a company has a fantastic global brandshare. The PS3 is doing fairly well in Europe and Japan (considering the runaway success of the Wii - and there's even some doubt that this can continue in Japan, where demand for the Wii has tapered off quite a bit lately). It's only in North America where the PS3 continues to lag, but the NA market is quite large.

So in short, trying to track end user sales is a complicated mess who's accuracy leaves much to be desired. Shipped numbers, on the other hand, are much more easily tracked and reported. These are publically traded companies. They can't lie about those numbers without risking being nailed in audits.

Yes, these numbers lag behind end user sales. But they're highly representative of actual end user sales on a global level. Retailers aren't stupid. Their ordering habits are usually going to mirror actual sales rather closely.

There are lies, there are damn lies, and then there are statistics. I agree that using a shipped instead of sold figure is only a "little white lie", in the sense that those shipped items will - sooner or later - be sold through, but it's the "sooner or later" that is the crux of the issue. It can take retailers many months to sell through an overstock.

Sony's not the only one guilty of this sort of number-fuzzing chicanery. Microsoft did something similar when they were boasting about the Xbox 360 hitting 10M "sold" back in 2007.

http://www.joystiq.com/2007/01/05/xb...nnounces-iptv/

The eventual fallout from this was that retailers had a huge glut of product that took many months to sell through; Microsoft had sent more product than had been ordered.

Besides, we're comparing Sony's shipped numbers versus Microsoft's shipped numbers. There's really no more accurate statistic for comparing the two which we have access to. And those numbers say Sony is gaining. And that's well in line with the way both companies are actually behaving (all press statements and media commentary aside).

Worldwide? The PS3 probably is making some progress against the 360. How much is an open question, but the smart money would guesstimate that the PS3 is probably sitting somewhere near 20M install base worldwide, with the 360 closing in on 25-30M and the Wii somewhere north of that in the 30-35M range, all numbers give or take several million since no one knows for sure how much product is just sitting on shelves in the retailer pipeline.

[PepeGameblouse]

i have one out of 21 million.

[SkantDragon]

Originally Posted by Icemage

Worldwide? The PS3 probably is making some progress against the 360. How much is an open question, but the smart money would guesstimate that the PS3 is probably sitting somewhere near 20M install base worldwide, with the 360 closing in on 25-30M and the Wii somewhere north of that in the 30-35M range, all numbers give or take several million since no one knows for sure how much product is just sitting on shelves in the retailer pipeline.

We do actually more or less agree on our assessments on the state of things.

I guess what I'm really getting at is that tracking end user sales is beyond the understanding of most people. A lot of people look at the NPD figures alone and declare the PS3 hopeless. In order to understand what is really going on, you have to delve into numbers from multiple different publications and do a lot of analysis. And even then that analysis is difficult for the average joe to do even if he knows how because critical statistics are commonly withheld.

There is a substantial difference between what the media reports, what the general public thinks, and what is really going on with sales in these console wars. The level of misinformation is pretty severe. And that situation is in part created by how difficult it is to understand what all these end user sales numbers actually mean.

The number of units shipped by each company is far simpler, isn't based on estimations, and isn't split out across several different sources. For the average person, I think it serves as a generally more honest, simple, and accurate indicator of the relative success of various platforms.

Yes, as you point out, it can still be warped to a degree by companies such as Microsoft had done. But predominantly it's a pretty good number to use for relative comparisons. At least as far as numbers that people who aren't MaxPower have access to.