Damn Customs

[jdc115]

Originally Posted by richieb1971

I could buy a harrier jumpjet from ebay and not get charged customs.

The last time I was charged was when laserdisc was around.

Perhaps, but it does not make it legal. I think it is one think when an individual send something worth $100 and says "gift" with a value of $5. Technically, not legal but customs is not going to do very much, maybe ask the receiver to pay import tax on $100 if they have a cut off that low.

But it is very tricky for a business. Regardless of the price they are selling at, they have to value the goods according to whatever method is required for the country that you are shipping to. Most countries use similar methods but really you sometimes have to have local experts help in all those countries. Companies can be scrutinized much closer and if they get caught under-declaring the goods then customs can audit them and go back and review all their shipments into their country.

It is a pain, but what can you do when you are dealing with a large corporation, they can not risk breaking laws into all the countries they ship to.

[BluMonkey]

Originally Posted by jdc115

This really is not their fault. Regardless of the discount they offered, they are suppose to declare the true value of the goods that the export to comply with all laws. Customs often compares like goods when auditing things being imported so they would have to be consistent on the value declared for each of the same goods.

If somebody send you a plasma TV for free, it still has to have a declared value that will have to be paid when it is imported. It is the same for other items, if they give you a discount but not your neighbor, as far as import department is concerned, that value declared should be the same as they are the same goods.

I have no problem with that .. the problem is they put the total value not the individual value ... $19 is only £10 I only pay Duty etc over £18 or $36
But because they put a total value of $119 I have to stump up £18 which is just because of the label ie I could order 1000's of disks @ $36 and not pay duty as long as each one is under that amount but if you call it one item and its 1000 x $36 then I will have to pay

[cartier]

Originally Posted by Number3

Anyway soon it will be cheap in America too (it already is for europeans since your governement destroyed the dollar) as your country plunges into recession.

A couple things are wrong with this first statement. While tax policies, spending and monetary policy have influenced the declining dollar, China is a major factor and the associate trade deficits. This is a problem now starting to influence European economies as well at the rate of €15 Million, per hour, according to an article either from the BBC, IHT, or WSJ forgive me it was a few months ago. There is also the global public opinion of the current administration which is a point I will not delve into further.

Originally Posted by Number3

But seriously how can you call Europe boring. We have nearly 230 languages here, 48 countries, which means 48 different cultures, 700 million people, etc etc. As soon as we find a bit of land we dont stick a car park on it. Oh admire a building which is just 20yrs old and think it is ancient.

I do not believe anyone who has been to Europe would call it boring, unless they only do the same thing over and over again then it might become redundant and boring. While I do appreciate your sarcasm, and there are those in The US who have not experienced other parts of the world it is unwise to post such assumptions about the entire United States based on observations or limited direct experiences. Just as it would be unwise for me to base my opinion of Sweden or Swedes on a week I spent in Stockholm, you can not all be wonderful people.

Originally Posted by Number3

Its a shame becuase your ignorance of counties has been an effective foreign policy so far....

I would contest that the current administration has not so much been ignorant of other countries as it has rather ignored them, a pity I assure you. Perhaps, in another year things will be different, for the better.

Originally Posted by Number3

And hey we dont have to worry about any format war over here. I cant even find HD-DVD in the shops here.

An issue becoming less and less of a problem every day.

[jdc115]

Originally Posted by BluMonkey

I have no problem with that .. the problem is they put the total value not the individual value ... $19 is only £10 I only pay Duty etc over £18 or $36
But because they put a total value of $119 I have to stump up £18 which is just because of the label ie I could order 1000's of disks @ $36 and not pay duty as long as each one is under that amount but if you call it one item and its 1000 x $36 then I will have to pay

Sorry, I misunderstood, do you mean they partially shipped your order and put the value of the complete order on the shipment? If so, then that is just wrong. Their commecial invoice should reflect the value of the individual items contained within that shipment. If not, something seems screwed up.

[jdc115]

Originally Posted by cartier

A couple things are wrong with this first statement. While tax policies, spending and monetary policy have influenced the declining dollar, China is a major factor and the associate trade deficits. This is a problem now starting to influence European economies as well at the rate of €15 Million, per hour, according to an article either from the BBC, IHT, or WSJ forgive me it was a few months ago. There is also the global public opinion of the current administration which is a point I will not delve into further.




I do not believe anyone who has been to Europe would call it boring, unless they only do the same thing over and over again then it might become redundant and boring. While I do appreciate your sarcasm, and there are those in The US who have not experienced other parts of the world it is unwise to post such assumptions about the entire United States based on observations or limited direct experiences. Just as it would be unwise for me to base my opinion of Sweden or Swedes on a week I spent in Stockholm, you can not all be wonderful people.

Not to speak for Numbers but he was responding to somebody that made a very generalization about Europe being boring. I was also a bit taken back by the post partly cause it is the general kind of statement that makes foreigners look upon Americans as being close minded and not interested in cultures outside of their own.

As far as the dollar, it both helps me and worries me. The decreasing dollar is like a pay raise on one side. But it will also start hurting those countries that still depend on the US for most of their exports. But will US rates being so long for a while, the dollar becomes less of a good investment and many start investing in other countries that offer more returns though with more risk. I am hoping it won't repeat of 2000-2001. As much as they say Asia is become more inter-related and not as much dependent on the US economy, they will are the driving force for the economies out here.

[cartier]

Originally Posted by jdc115

Not to speak for Numbers but he was responding to somebody that made a very generalization about Europe being boring. I was also a bit taken back by the post partly cause it is the general kind of statement that makes foreigners look upon Americans as being close minded and not interested in cultures outside of their own.

I saw the other post that led to Numbers' comments and that is why I questioned the activities that the other individual does in Europe, there is enough to see and do there to keep one very busy. I just wanted to caution him about making such broad generalization of Americans.

Originally Posted by jdc115

As far as the dollar, it both helps me and worries me. The decreasing dollar is like a pay raise on one side. But it will also start hurting those countries that still depend on the US for most of their exports. But will US rates being so long for a while, the dollar becomes less of a good investment and many start investing in other countries that offer more returns though with more risk. I am hoping it won't repeat of 2000-2001. As much as they say Asia is become more inter-related and not as much dependent on the US economy, they will are the driving force for the economies out here.

The status of the dollar is of great concern to me as well. I feel that a great deal of the global economic problems come from China's monetary policy specifically the Yuan (Renminbi) valuation. In becoming such a large trading partner with the rest of the world they are creating instability as they are the only major trading partner of the Western nations that do not float their currency, instead going with a fixed/weighted approach. However, you are right that given the current global economy a major economic downturn in the US will have major ramifications throughout the world.

[lgans316]

Originally Posted by jdc115

This really is not their fault. Regardless of the discount they offered, they are suppose to declare the true value of the goods that the export to comply with all laws. Customs often compares like goods when auditing things being imported so they would have to be consistent on the value declared for each of the same goods.

If somebody send you a plasma TV for free, it still has to have a declared value that will have to be paid when it is imported. It is the same for other items, if they give you a discount but not your neighbor, as far as import department is concerned, that value declared should be the same as they are the same goods.

I agree to an extent but prior to the shipping date I would request the merchant to put the amount that the buyer will actually pay.

Sitting in customs sensitive regions like U.K / E.U it's the responsibility of the buyers to take preventive measures to avoid being slapped by customs.

The customer is always right but it doesn't mean that the merchant is always wrong.

I rate amazon as the most customer friendly site. Who does a price match on completed orders ?

I would request the OP to consider this as a bad experience or return the package and move on.

[BluMonkey]

..........

I went into the sorting office and asked to see the package in question...

As I suspected it is exactly the same as all the other packages I've had from ebay ... post mark is Frankfurt ... which technically should sail through customs... the plot thickens..

I pointed out to the dithering muppet behind the counter (this may sound cruel but you weren't there), that the post mark was in the EU and showed her the invoice I had taken with me to show that inside the box the individual items were less than the £18 limit and therefore I should not have been charged...

She basically said tough either we can return it or I pay the charges...

Tact two (bare in mind this is a busy sorting office and I had a huge audience ughhh) - I read her the riot act saying that legally under section 104 of the Postal Act 2000, they had no legal right to delay or hold my parcel and that any duty due was a civil matter between myself and customs...

she came back with .. we paid the duty on your behalf so you owe us and the charge for our service of paying the duty...

grrr I explaind that there is no legislation that give them the right to impose this service on me and if they have paid charges to customs they should take it up with them and over my goods which they are unlawfully holding...

She took the parcel back handed me a card saying ring customer services ...

I got in the car and rang them ...

Got through after several attempts and explained my problem to the lady who answered...

She said that they did have the right to hold onto the goods as I owed them for the charges they had paid, I asked her to tell me what legislation gives her the right to pay customs and charge me for doing so without my legal consent ... she said that there is a notice in all post offices that states as from April 2007 they now charge and pay the duty for us ...

But I said ok thats what you have chosen to do but where legally does it state I'm bound by that ... erm erm erm ... no answer..

She said I will speak to your sorting office and come back to you in a few minutes ...

30 mins later no call so I rang them again...

This time I got through to Belfast and went through the whole thing all over again ...

The guy said simply you paid customes Yes but its customs who levid the duty not us .. speak to them ... and with that gave me thr number a nd went off the line...

Ok so then I rang HMS customs and excise ...

The lady was really polite and helpful and I learned about the big scam ...

She said ...

The limit of £18 is not per Item but per package
athough if I could prove that the individual items were ordered on different days and the sender packaged them in one parcel they would look @ it, but this would involve getting the office to send it back to customs...

she said re the post mark .. technically I'm correct that if its inside the EU no charges should be levid, however they could ask me to provide evidence that I have paid the duty and tax in Frankfurt which is even higher than ours ...

Basically I'm screwed...

But this seems to be the scam from what each of the people I spoke to have said...

Customs must struggle to recover duty on items so the easiest thing to do is get the post compaines to pay it then recover it from you, which they are happy to do so as they charge £8 + for the privelage...
But again there is no legislation that enforces this its just each companies policy...

The other thing that all 3 asked was ...

Is it a parcel from AMAZON ... I said yes and they all said there is a lot being stopped ... the Smile on the box is giving the game away ...

This is the 1st Ive had stopped and have let be returned .... I think I will ask amazon to re send and keep my fingers crossed ...

Or pay amazon extra and package everything seperate...

Or as I've done today ... rent a US address with a forwarding company who will re package and invoice the items for me...

This country sucks BIG !!!

[hayzink]

how do you do that forwarding company bit and whats the costs

[BluMonkey]

Originally Posted by hayzink

how do you do that forwarding company bit and whats the costs

www.mailforwarding.biz

[hayzink]

Originally Posted by BluMonkey

www.mailforwarding.biz

many thanks for the link just looked at it that could provide well useful.

[BluMonkey]

Originally Posted by hayzink

many thanks for the link just looked at it that could provide well useful.

Ive just ordered a PS3 80gb from amazon .. will PM you if you want when it arrives ...

[eat_me_cool]

Originally Posted by BluMonkey

..........

I went into the sorting office and asked to see the package in question...

As I suspected it is exactly the same as all the other packages I've had from ebay ... post mark is Frankfurt ... which technically should sail through customs... the plot thickens..

I pointed out to the dithering muppet behind the counter (this may sound cruel but you weren't there), that the post mark was in the EU and showed her the invoice I had taken with me to show that inside the box the individual items were less than the £18 limit and therefore I should not have been charged...

She basically said tough either we can return it or I pay the charges...

Tact two (bare in mind this is a busy sorting office and I had a huge audience ughhh) - I read her the riot act saying that legally under section 104 of the Postal Act 2000, they had no legal right to delay or hold my parcel and that any duty due was a civil matter between myself and customs...

she came back with .. we paid the duty on your behalf so you owe us and the charge for our service of paying the duty...

grrr I explaind that there is no legislation that give them the right to impose this service on me and if they have paid charges to customs they should take it up with them and over my goods which they are unlawfully holding...

She took the parcel back handed me a card saying ring customer services ...

I got in the car and rang them ...

Got through after several attempts and explained my problem to the lady who answered...

She said that they did have the right to hold onto the goods as I owed them for the charges they had paid, I asked her to tell me what legislation gives her the right to pay customs and charge me for doing so without my legal consent ... she said that there is a notice in all post offices that states as from April 2007 they now charge and pay the duty for us ...

But I said ok thats what you have chosen to do but where legally does it state I'm bound by that ... erm erm erm ... no answer..

She said I will speak to your sorting office and come back to you in a few minutes ...

30 mins later no call so I rang them again...

This time I got through to Belfast and went through the whole thing all over again ...

The guy said simply you paid customes Yes but its customs who levid the duty not us .. speak to them ... and with that gave me thr number a nd went off the line...

Ok so then I rang HMS customs and excise ...

The lady was really polite and helpful and I learned about the big scam ...

She said ...

The limit of £18 is not per Item but per package
athough if I could prove that the individual items were ordered on different days and the sender packaged them in one parcel they would look @ it, but this would involve getting the office to send it back to customs...

she said re the post mark .. technically I'm correct that if its inside the EU no charges should be levid, however they could ask me to provide evidence that I have paid the duty and tax in Frankfurt which is even higher than ours ...

Basically I'm screwed...

But this seems to be the scam from what each of the people I spoke to have said...

Customs must struggle to recover duty on items so the easiest thing to do is get the post compaines to pay it then recover it from you, which they are happy to do so as they charge £8 + for the privelage...
But again there is no legislation that enforces this its just each companies policy...

The other thing that all 3 asked was ...

Is it a parcel from AMAZON ... I said yes and they all said there is a lot being stopped ... the Smile on the box is giving the game away ...

This is the 1st Ive had stopped and have let be returned .... I think I will ask amazon to re send and keep my fingers crossed ...

Or pay amazon extra and package everything seperate...

Or as I've done today ... rent a US address with a forwarding company who will re package and invoice the items for me...

This country sucks BIG !!!

Refuse delivery and Amazon will resend it and the chances are you won't have to pay the fee.

Its the easy option and the one recommended by Amazon.

[BluFan]

Originally Posted by Cobalt

Lol, way over $36k. Over $130k. See sig.

That has to be one of the most obnoxious things anyone has ever said on this site. Don't really see how a vehicle ties into the home entertainment list.

[hayzink]

Originally Posted by BluMonkey

www.mailforwarding.biz

thanks that will give it feedback before i try it

[BluMonkey]

Originally Posted by eat_me_cool

Refuse delivery and Amazon will resend it and the chances are you won't have to pay the fee.

Its the easy option and the one recommended by Amazon.

yep It was just the priciple behind it this country has gone to the dogs

Do they automatically re send it ?

[DS1975]

Luckily I'm in Switzerland and since we have "only" a VAT of 7.6% the packages from Amazon sail trough customs in 90% of the cases.
The maximum amount is around 65 Swiss Francs (roughly £29/$54) and over that there is VAT to be paid.

Today I received the package from Amazon with Departed/Letters of Iwo Jima from the BOGO Sale = no VAT!

Interestingly most Amazon shipments (from the US) arrive here via New Zealand!
I don't know what's the deal behind this but at least to me it doesn't make sense to go from the US to Switzerland via New Zealand!
That happens with the Standard Shipping Option...

[Number3]

Originally Posted by cartier

I saw the other post that led to Numbers' comments and that is why I questioned the activities that the other individual does in Europe, there is enough to see and do there to keep one very busy. I just wanted to caution him about making such broad generalization of Americans.

The status of the dollar is of great concern to me as well. I feel that a great deal of the global economic problems come from China's monetary policy specifically the Yuan (Renminbi) valuation. In becoming such a large trading partner with the rest of the world they are creating instability as they are the only major trading partner of the Western nations that do not float their currency, instead going with a fixed/weighted approach. However, you are right that given the current global economy a major economic downturn in the US will have major ramifications throughout the world.

I think we are on the same level here. Although I admit this is now going massively of topic now, but hey ho.

My wide generalisations regarding america are of course unfair, but were made really to show the point that statements such as those help nobody and are rarely grounded in fact.

What I am interested in though, is just how much people think the format war in the USA will afffect it overall. As stated before Europe is very much blu and really there never was a war here. As for Japan well good luck trying to sell an Xbox over there. So you guys are the last custodians of the HD-DUD format. So I trust and leave it in your capable hands in order to remove it from our planet and let us continue to enjoy our 1080p films and lossless audio.

It was funny as the other night there were two americans sat next to me in the hotel restaurant. 1 had obviously been to Gothenburg before and the other hadnt. The previous visitor said he was going to watch a hockey game. The other was taken aback that europeans played hockey!!! Of course I found that quite entertaining and what followed was an interesting discussion and the fact that Sweden won both the Winter Olympics and the World Championships of Ice Hockey in 2006!!!

Both were really nice guys and I guess it showed that we arent different at all, and sure I sympathise that you guys as you have a channel called Fox News. But what it really showed it that educating each other can be an enlightning experience. I learnt so much about Georgia.

And really isnt that the essence of this site?

(oh I just went all poetic..... better go and buy some beers and watch some football, before I turn into a lady and stall spending all my money on handbags and shoes! - doh! another generalisation. )

[BluMonkey]

Ive emailed ebay about an order before the one that Ive had the problems with ... as that hasn't even shown up ...

It seems they also are having problems with customs this is an extract of their reply...

Please note that our shipping department has informed us of an issue with replacement orders shipped outside the U.S., particularly those shipped Priority International.

Because the value of these orders is $0.00, these orders are often stopped by customs officials and either delayed or returned to our fulfillment centers. Customs officials need to know the value of a shipment so they can assess the appropriate fees to have the package clear customs.

In order to avoid issues on the order, we create replacement order with charges and then refunded the same amount on the original order. Please note that this refunded will be credited back to your original method of payment. You can also verify this refund with your credit card company.

However, our developers are building a process to list the value of package contents even when the cost to our customer is $0.00, it will be some time before this process is in place.

As a representative of Amazon.com, I want to assure you that we value our customers' trust above all else--it's the foundation on which our company was built. Please know that we'll continue working hard to ensure that you receive accurate service, and to minimize the chances of anything like this occurring again

[BluMonkey]

Ok They've just done it again this morning on another order from amazon.com
This time the amount to pay is £20

As per my conversation with customs a word of warning....

Ive read the details on HMSC website and they arn't following their own wording .... it states over £18 for items charges due ...

But on the phone I was told it was per package

They are playing on words and a definately looking for the smile on the box...

Im now going to use a fowarding service in the States and have them re packed and invoiced... and use amazon free delivery etc ...

The woman @ customs also laughed on how stupid it is that if I had them posted seperate there would be no charges.





I'm going to ring customs again on Monday as i've been reading up on their website and have found the following

If you receive goods and you wish to reject part of a consignment within 30 days you can reclaim duty on that part of the consignment ... so my question is ... if the can look @ items within a consignment as seperate when your retuening them and claiming back the duty, why can't they look @ the consignment as individual items when applying the duty in the first place ...

Also found out that the value which the duty is charged also must include postal insurance & postage costs .... Robbing B##tards ... The more I read the angrier I get ... no wonder companies over here are moving their factories abroad...