Star Wars: The Complete Saga (1977-2005)

[Lionel Horsepackage]

Originally Posted by Arawn

The probem is that Obi-Wan says that the Jedi were guardians of peace & justice in the Old Republic for a thousand generations, while Palpatine says the Republic has stood for a thousand years. The EU handled this via the Ruusan Reformations; Palpatine's referring only to the current version of the Republic. Alternatively it's just a figure of (imprecise) speech signifying a very long time.

And also, Palpatine's line in AOTC was very likely just a slipup/gaffe on the part of the screenwriters (George Lucas and Jonathan Hales) -- whoever wrote that line undoubtedly had Alec Guinness's dialogue from ANH in mind ("For over a thousand generations..."), but accidentally wrote "[a] thousand years" instead, and the error made it through subsequent script-drafts unchecked. But in a weird way, it makes the entire history of the SW universe that much more realistic and interesting, since there's now a brand-new facet (the Light and Darkness War, the Ruusan Reformations) to learn about as a result of this.

[Panama Jack]

Well remember, everything Obi-Wan said in ANH is only true "from a certain point of view," and Palpatine's a huge lying Sith, so take it all with a ginormous grain of salt.

[PeterTHX]

Originally Posted by Arawn

The probem is that Obi-Wan says that the Jedi were guardians of peace & justice in the Old Republic for a thousand generations, while Palpatine says the Republic has stood for a thousand years. The EU handled this via the Ruusan Reformations; Palpatine's referring only to the current version of the Republic. Alternatively it's just a figure of (imprecise) speech signifying a very long time.

Palpatine says "I will not let this Republic, which has stood for a thousand years, be split in two."

He doesn't say "only" or "less" a thousand years. So...

[octagon]

Originally Posted by veritas

so not an inconsistency we don't know obi wans thought process but its reasonable he either forget about Leia or disregarded Leia (or perhaps he was just trying to manipulate yoda like he manipulated Luke obi wan as an old man bent the truth all the time to get the result he wanted).

Yeah, maybe Obi-wan just forgot that Luke had a sister. Or maybe he remembered that the Chosen One had two kids but figured that only one of them inherited the Skywalker force juju. I don't know about reasonable but I suppose those are both possible.

But maybe - just maybe - this is one of those times where a cigar is just a cigar. Maybe Lucas just changed the story midstream and some of the earlier stuff isn't consistent with the new story.

[bobbyh64]

I just watched my PT Blu-rays since I recently bought the box set and hadn’t seen the films in a few years. I used to think they were okay but now I consider myself a fan of them.

TPM is pretty entertaining from start to finish. I think the pod race is a bit too long but it’s not a big deal. I love all the scenes where Qui-Gon talks to Anakin about the Force.

AOTC surprised me because it’s nowhere near as bad as I thought. I actually like it a lot. I like how it goes back and forth between Obi-Wan’s detective story, which I feel is pretty interesting, and the relationship between Anakin and Padme. The first hour and 45 minutes is very good but then when the whole arena battle starts, I feel like it gets a bit too ridiculous and isn’t as interesting. I also think it’s strange that the Jedi are willing to use a clone army that was made from an assassin who tried to kill Padme and Obi-Wan, and the fact that they had no prior knowledge of the creation of the army or what its purpose was should make them extremely suspicious.

ROTS is awesome, the best of the three. So many good sequences. Right from the start I was eagerly waiting for the scene when Palpatine reveals himself as the Sith Lord. I love all those weird expressions he makes and pieces of dialogue where he kind of slips into his Emperor self. I also love the scene where he talks to Anakin about Darth Plagueis with that giant floating bubble-thing (no idea what that is and don’t really care) with John Williams’ haunting score. My only problem with the film is that I don’t quite buy Anakin’s turn to the Dark Side. It seemed to happen too fast and he seemed pretty stupid when he was taking to Padme and Obi-Wan near the end. It’s also hard for to me accept that he’d kill a bunch of kids so that his wife could survive (wtf?). If he hadn’t done that my opinion of the film would be higher, which is already pretty high.

One thing I’m curious about is, are newcomers to this franchise who watch in episode order not expected to know that Palpatine is the Emperor until the third film when he reveals himself to Anakin? I feel like there are little clues that make it kind of obvious. Even if you can’t see that they’re the same actor, at the end of TPM when Yoda and Mace Windu are taking about how there are always two Sith, a master and an apprentice, Windu asks which one was destroyed, and it cuts and pans over to Palpatine. To me this should be incredibly obvious and I’d like to know if Lucas intended this or if it’s supposed to be a surprise until Ep. III.

[The Mediocre Owl]

Originally Posted by bobbyh64

I just watched my PT Blu-rays since I recently bought the box set and hadn’t seen the films in a few years. I used to think they were okay but now I consider myself a fan of them.

TPM is pretty entertaining from start to finish. I think the pod race is a bit too long but it’s not a big deal. I love all the scenes where Qui-Gon talks to Anakin about the Force.

AOTC surprised me because it’s nowhere near as bad as I thought. I actually like it a lot. I like how it goes back and forth between Obi-Wan’s detective story, which I feel is pretty interesting, and the relationship between Anakin and Padme. The first hour and 45 minutes is very good but then when the whole arena battle starts, I feel like it gets a bit too ridiculous and isn’t as interesting. I also think it’s strange that the Jedi are willing to use a clone army that was made from an assassin who tried to kill Padme and Obi-Wan, and the fact that they had no prior knowledge of the creation of the army or what its purpose was should make them extremely suspicious.

ROTS is awesome, the best of the three. So many good sequences. Right from the start I was eagerly waiting for the scene when Palpatine reveals himself as the Sith Lord. I love all those weird expressions he makes and pieces of dialogue where he kind of slips into his Emperor self. I also love the scene where he talks to Anakin about Darth Plagueis with that giant floating bubble-thing (no idea what that is and don’t really care) with John Williams’ haunting score. My only problem with the film is that I don’t quite buy Anakin’s turn to the Dark Side. It seemed to happen too fast and he seemed pretty stupid when he was taking to Padme and Obi-Wan near the end. It’s also hard for to me accept that he’d kill a bunch of kids so that his wife could survive (wtf?). If he hadn’t done that my opinion of the film would be higher, which is already pretty high.

One thing I’m curious about is, are newcomers to this franchise who watch in episode order not expected to know that Palpatine is the Emperor until the third film when he reveals himself to Anakin? I feel like there are little clues that make it kind of obvious. Even if you can’t see that they’re the same actor, at the end of TPM when Yoda and Mace Windu are taking about how there are always two Sith, a master and an apprentice, Windu asks which one was destroyed, and it cuts and pans over to Palpatine. To me this should be incredibly obvious and I’d like to know if Lucas intended this or if it’s supposed to be a surprise until Ep. III.

I don't think it was intended as an Episode III surprise. Otherwise, why have Yoda say "the shroud of the dark side has fallen" and then cut to Palpatine looking over the clone troops with the imperial march blaring. New viewers possibly wouldn't recognize the music, but the implication is still not subtle.

[ben6543]

Originally Posted by bobbyh64

I just watched my PT Blu-rays since I recently bought the box set and hadn’t seen the films in a few years. I used to think they were okay but now I consider myself a fan of them.

TPM is pretty entertaining from start to finish. I think the pod race is a bit too long but it’s not a big deal. I love all the scenes where Qui-Gon talks to Anakin about the Force.

AOTC surprised me because it’s nowhere near as bad as I thought. I actually like it a lot. I like how it goes back and forth between Obi-Wan’s detective story, which I feel is pretty interesting, and the relationship between Anakin and Padme. The first hour and 45 minutes is very good but then when the whole arena battle starts, I feel like it gets a bit too ridiculous and isn’t as interesting. I also think it’s strange that the Jedi are willing to use a clone army that was made from an assassin who tried to kill Padme and Obi-Wan, and the fact that they had no prior knowledge of the creation of the army or what its purpose was should make them extremely suspicious.

ROTS is awesome, the best of the three. So many good sequences. Right from the start I was eagerly waiting for the scene when Palpatine reveals himself as the Sith Lord. I love all those weird expressions he makes and pieces of dialogue where he kind of slips into his Emperor self. I also love the scene where he talks to Anakin about Darth Plagueis with that giant floating bubble-thing (no idea what that is and don’t really care) with John Williams’ haunting score. My only problem with the film is that I don’t quite buy Anakin’s turn to the Dark Side. It seemed to happen too fast and he seemed pretty stupid when he was taking to Padme and Obi-Wan near the end. It’s also hard for to me accept that he’d kill a bunch of kids so that his wife could survive (wtf?). If he hadn’t done that my opinion of the film would be higher, which is already pretty high.

One thing I’m curious about is, are newcomers to this franchise who watch in episode order not expected to know that Palpatine is the Emperor until the third film when he reveals himself to Anakin? I feel like there are little clues that make it kind of obvious. Even if you can’t see that they’re the same actor, at the end of TPM when Yoda and Mace Windu are taking about how there are always two Sith, a master and an apprentice, Windu asks which one was destroyed, and it cuts and pans over to Palpatine. To me this should be incredibly obvious and I’d like to know if Lucas intended this or if it’s supposed to be a surprise until Ep. III.

Count me in with this also. Heard nothing but hate about Episode 1 and 2 from Whiny fanboys just rewatched them recently and loved them.

[Arawn]

Originally Posted by bobbyh64

I also think it’s strange that the Jedi are willing to use a clone army that was made from an assassin who tried to kill Padme and Obi-Wan, and the fact that they had no prior knowledge of the creation of the army or what its purpose was should make them extremely suspicious.

They can be suspicious. But that doesn't change the fact that they're in a position where they need an army. And mercenaries hiring themselves out to both sides of a conflict is not exactly unheard of in a historical sense. Plus, Jedi have been known to sometimes go "off the reservation" and disobey the Council. (I'm looking at you, Qui-Gon.)

Originally Posted by bobbyh64

One thing I’m curious about is, are newcomers to this franchise who watch in episode order not expected to know that Palpatine is the Emperor until the third film when he reveals himself to Anakin?

For whatever it's worth, the tie-in media during the period between the releases of TPM and ROTS steadfastly avoided any outright depiction of Palpatine and Sidious as the same person. It didn't seem like an accident.

[Geoff D]

Always liked TPM. I'd rather have the theatrical cut but hey, it wouldn't be Star Wars otherwise.

AOTC I'm the complete opposite on. IMO it's an immensely terrible film until it gets to the arena battle when the Jedi go to war, that stuff is fantastic. People sometimes question why the Jedi lead the army ( and an army of slaves at that) but remember that in the final version of the film the army was apparently initiated by a Jedi, that and they had little choice - it was that or let the Republic be overrun right then and there. And don't forget that one of the main back stories of the film is that the Senate is voting on the creation of an ARMY OF THE REPUBLIC (bolded just like the crawl ), which eventually gets passed into law by Palpatine and so when the Clone army is 'discovered' it's immediately pressed into service. And having the Jedi fight in the Clone Wars meant that their view of the Force was shrouded yet further.

ROTS I love, it's my favourite prequel and one of my favourite SW films full stop. It's still a bit clunky here and there and it's a damned shame that the rebellion subplot was cut out but Lucas finally shook off his ring rust and got to grips with his digital technology, not letting it overwhelm the story. Or perhaps it's more that the meat of the prequel story takes place in Sith so it was always going to feel like the stakes were higher and that the weight of the story overcomes the endless digital ****ery, not the other way around.

[Alan_Grant]

Originally Posted by bobbyh64

I just watched my PT Blu-rays since I recently bought the box set and hadn’t seen the films in a few years. I used to think they were okay but now I consider myself a fan of them.

TPM is pretty entertaining from start to finish. I think the pod race is a bit too long but it’s not a big deal. I love all the scenes where Qui-Gon talks to Anakin about the Force.

AOTC surprised me because it’s nowhere near as bad as I thought. I actually like it a lot. I like how it goes back and forth between Obi-Wan’s detective story, which I feel is pretty interesting, and the relationship between Anakin and Padme. The first hour and 45 minutes is very good but then when the whole arena battle starts, I feel like it gets a bit too ridiculous and isn’t as interesting. I also think it’s strange that the Jedi are willing to use a clone army that was made from an assassin who tried to kill Padme and Obi-Wan, and the fact that they had no prior knowledge of the creation of the army or what its purpose was should make them extremely suspicious.

ROTS is awesome, the best of the three. So many good sequences. Right from the start I was eagerly waiting for the scene when Palpatine reveals himself as the Sith Lord. I love all those weird expressions he makes and pieces of dialogue where he kind of slips into his Emperor self. I also love the scene where he talks to Anakin about Darth Plagueis with that giant floating bubble-thing (no idea what that is and don’t really care) with John Williams’ haunting score. My only problem with the film is that I don’t quite buy Anakin’s turn to the Dark Side. It seemed to happen too fast and he seemed pretty stupid when he was taking to Padme and Obi-Wan near the end. It’s also hard for to me accept that he’d kill a bunch of kids so that his wife could survive (wtf?). If he hadn’t done that my opinion of the film would be higher, which is already pretty high.

One thing I’m curious about is, are newcomers to this franchise who watch in episode order not expected to know that Palpatine is the Emperor until the third film when he reveals himself to Anakin? I feel like there are little clues that make it kind of obvious. Even if you can’t see that they’re the same actor, at the end of TPM when Yoda and Mace Windu are taking about how there are always two Sith, a master and an apprentice, Windu asks which one was destroyed, and it cuts and pans over to Palpatine. To me this should be incredibly obvious and I’d like to know if Lucas intended this or if it’s supposed to be a surprise until Ep. III.

I don't like clones, never have never will. I'm happy when people say they enjoy it though. However, TPM/ROTS are really, really good movies that suffered way too much blowback; especially TPM.

Time has been kind to the Prequels (and I think Disney churning out mediocre movies every single year helps them too IMO.) RLM even said something (somewhat) nice about them, which is a shock:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YV9m8frtGHg

[crissrudd4554]

I’ve never really minded TPM. For the most part I’ve found it enjoyable warts and all. AOTC is probably my least favorite of the prequels. I don’t dislike it but even when I saw it in its original release I just left with an ‘ehh not one of the better ones’ kinda feeling. The dinner scene between Anakin and Padme where he uses the Force to fly the food to her I was never big on. Yoda’s dual with Dooku I’ve always liked. ROTS what I can i say? I loved it when I first saw it. Yes it has a few plot holes when you connect them to 4-6 among other things but I felt it was the most spectacular of the prequels. 4-6 will always be my bread and butter Star Wars wise but I do have a place for the prequels and don’t mind watching them every now and then.

[happydood]

I've loved Star Wars since I was a boy. I still do. I love George Lucas' hand-made, sometimes cock-eyed, and often silly vision. I'm also not sure which is more hilarious- folks bending over backwards to explain plot inconsistencies or confrontational folks telling them they have to.

[TheBoss062]

Might buy this soon, since i don't think the unaltered versions of the original trilogy will ever surface. While I do think the book is very snazzy, It's too risky and impractical because these cardboard sleves are notorious for scratching blu-ray discs.

I'm so glad the Darth Vader slipcover edition was released, It's just a standard blu-ray case.

[HD Goofnut]

Originally Posted by TheBoss062

Might buy this soon, since i don't think the unaltered versions of the original trilogy will ever surface. While I do think the book is very snazzy, It's too risky and impractical because these cardboard sleves are notorious for scratching blu-ray discs.

I'm so glad the Darth Vader slipcover edition was released, It's just a standard blu-ray case.

This is still not true. None of my discs in this, the Aliens, or Indy sets have ever been scratched.

[TheBoss062]

Originally Posted by HD Goofnut

This is still not true. None of my discs in this, the Aliens, or Indy sets have ever been scratched.

Just because you got lucky and have undamaged discs doesn't mean others haven't.

[bobbyh64]

Originally Posted by TheBoss062

Might buy this soon, since i don't think the unaltered versions of the original trilogy will ever surface. While I do think the book is very snazzy, It's too risky and impractical because these cardboard sleves are notorious for scratching blu-ray discs.

I'm so glad the Darth Vader slipcover edition was released, It's just a standard blu-ray case.

I bought the set a few months ago and prefer the packaging. I like Vader on the cover and also the case. I believe the older case has the disc-holders glued in and I prefer cases that don’t have that.

Not releasing the unaltered OT would be a cinematic crime.

[TheBoss062]

Originally Posted by bobbyh64

I bought the set a few months ago and prefer the packaging. I like Vader on the cover and also the case. I believe the older case has the disc-holders glued in and I prefer cases that don’t have that.

Not releasing the unaltered OT would be a cinematic crime.

If I remember correctly, it's up to George Lucas to allow them to be released. And we all know how much he hates the unaltered originals.

[taymo016]

Originally Posted by TheBoss062

If I remember correctly, it's up to George Lucas to allow them to be released. And we all know how much he hates the unaltered originals.

That was a stipulation of Disney buying Lucasfilm is that the originals never see the light of day while he's alive.

But once he's passed and the Disney-Fox deal goes through, there'd be nothing stopping them.

[bobbyh64]

Originally Posted by taymo016

That was a stipulation of Disney buying Lucasfilm is that the originals never see the light of day while he's alive.

But once he's passed and the Disney-Fox deal goes through, there'd be nothing stopping them.

Do you have a source for that? That seems like a pretty strange stipulation. I would think if George didn’t want them to be released he’d require them to be withheld for as long as possible. What’s the point in delaying their release for only another 20 years? Might as well release them now. There will probably be less of a demand later on.

[taymo016]

Originally Posted by bobbyh64

Do you have a source for that? That seems like a pretty strange stipulation. I would think if George didn’t want them to be released he’d require them to be withheld for as long as possible. What’s the point in delaying their release for only another 20 years? Might as well release them now. There will probably be less of a demand later on.

A Lucasfilm employee tweeted recently

Good morning! What's kept the original theatrical editions off of home video is the same thing that's always been doing that. It's not a studio thing.

which implies it has something to do with GL.

When the deal was made, part of the deal said Disney couldn't revise the current versions of the six films. It was reported when the deal happened in 2012.

I'm not sure it was a stipulation that said "Can't release while alive", but he's been the reason thus far we don't have them. So one could assume that once he passes, Disney would have a better opportunity at releasing them if they choose to (which they probably won't).