The Matrix 4K UHD (1999)

[brainofj72]

Originally Posted by jabba359

Don't you mean, "Looks like it was shot on film and intended to be exhibited on film projectors with low peak brightness and limited dynamic range"?

Conversion to HDR can certainly exacerbate grain definition far beyond what appears naturally on film and what would have been seen theatrically back in 1999. I don't know if this is what's occurring with this disc (I don't have it yet), but complaints about graininess aren't mutually exclusive with liking natural film grain.

I don’t buy this argument. I’ve been going to a lot of 35mm screenings lately, and what has consistently struck me is how a good 4K HDR transfer is the first home video presentation that even comes close to replicating a proper 35mm in print in terms of grain, detail, color, and brightness. “Managing” grain instantly kills that, in my experience, because you remove that top player of fine detail that is super obvious when you’re watching a print.

[LordoftheRings]

Originally Posted by koberulz

My biggest problem with this remaster is it still tells the story through moving images accompanied by sound. I'd rather a remaster that told the story through written words, maybe printed on paper over a series of pages all bound together. You could still do chapters and things, you'd just have to manually find chapters by which page they're on, maybe with some sort of index of chapters at the start?

The Matrix is a Tarantino's sci-fi dream, a Villeneuve's second take on Blade Runner, a Scott's sequel on The Duellists.

[Jack Burton]

There are some major blown out highlights if you have a high nits peaks brightness tv. Especially the roof top scene near the end or the helicopter scene, every ones face looks like they are going to explode.

[The Duke]

Originally Posted by Jbabler

Wal-Mart has this available for shipping for $25.99. Add $9.01 of other stuff to get free shipping. Who can't find $10 of something to get from Walmart?

Yep, a bag of Beggin Strips treats for Marmaduke. I'll have The Matrix & the dog treats Friday. Screw you, Amazon.

BTW, my Wallyworld cart said only 7 copies left, now 6 - The Matrix UHD, they have plenty of Beggin Strips.

[Tru-way]

Another weekly episode of Grain Wars: A New Movie, will our hero Geoff Wan Kenobi save us in time? Find out next time!

[jh901]

The fact that several people who will never appreciate this release were smart enough to order it online, and have already watched it, bothers me.

<end rant>

[koberulz]

The fact that it's one of few reasonably-priced UHDs here bothers me. I really don't need the extra bulk of buying them individually and could do without buying anything for a bit having just had to replace my amp, but that price is making it hard to ignore.

[Bourne1886]

Originally Posted by jh901

The fact that several people who will never appreciate this release were smart enough to order it online, and have already watched it, bothers me.

<end rant>

I got it on release day does that make me a person who doesn’t appreciate it?! What a load of cobblers you spout!

[bluescholar]

Originally Posted by Tru-way

Another weekly episode of Grain Wars: A New Movie, will our hero Geoff Wan Kenobi save us in time? Find out next time!

He was laid low by DNRth Vader and now wanders the teal swamp talking about 'points of view' to anyone who will listen.

[Juan127]

Originally Posted by Jack Burton

There are some major blown out highlights if you have a high nits peaks brightness tv. Especially the roof top scene near the end or the helicopter scene, every ones face looks like they are going to explode.

this is true

[fighthefutureofhd]

One could say the picture was Michael Jacksonend to death.

[Pyoko]

Does the cyan artifact appear in Dolby Vision as well? I would think so, but DV can behave weirdly sometimes, maybe it also has the ability to "unweird" something like this.

[Shimshuta]

I’m watching it right now, the grain is glorious, go WB go. Hopefully the other two movies get the same treatment. Whenever the grain haters come out and ***** I know I’m in for a treat.

[mar3o]

Originally Posted by jmstone

I watched this last night on my LG C7/Xbox One - gotta say some of this looked amazing but other scenes were soo grainy I was embarrassed. The opening scene with Trinity is full of grain especially the cops flash lights. There was also a ton of grain in the interrogation scene with the Smiths. The white walls are so grainy as is Neo's face. Disappointing. Hard to believe this got a 5 star review for 4k.

Posts like this is why so many blu-rays and even UHD is hit by the DNR monster. Makes me sad.

[mar3o]

Originally Posted by Vilya

We went through the same thing when WB released Blade Runner on 4K. For weeks and weeks, it was hard to find and expensive if you did. Eventually, though, it became readily available and at a more attractive price.

Indeed.

I find it odd how they seem to be having a tough time getting some of these UHD titles in stores and in enough stock when they first release.

The price is another issue entirely though.

[jabba359]

Originally Posted by brainofj72

I don’t buy this argument. I’ve been going to a lot of 35mm screenings lately, and what has consistently struck me is how a good 4K HDR transfer is the first home video presentation that even comes close to replicating a proper 35mm in print in terms of grain, detail, color, and brightness. “Managing” grain instantly kills that, in my experience, because you remove that top player of fine detail that is super obvious when you’re watching a print.

Just because you don't buy it doesn't make it untrue. Even the 35mm prints you see have a grain softening going on, as the grain of the original camera negative gets filtered as it goes through the process of transferring from OCN to interpositive to dupe negative/internegative to release print. While the original camera negative, as shot, might have some sharp and harsh grain going on, the DP can count on it going through a few generations of transfers to soften it out a little bit. You can also count on a projector to soften out harsh edges due to how light scatters off a projection screen.

Now, taking this into a digital world, if you're scanning a master straight from the original camera negative, you're capturing the sharpest grain structure the film can offer. Whereas a DP could count on the image getting softened through multiple stages of copies being struck (theatrical viewing is typically 4th gen), you're now coming straight off the 1st gen image, with maximum sharpness intact, sharper than what you'd get in a theatrical experience. So if you want to replicate what is seen in the theater, some softening or management needs to occur to the digital image to duplicate the generational loss of sharpness film transfers would have introduced to the theatrical release print.

And that doesn't even cover the HDR conversion tinkering that can strengthen the appearance of film grain over what would have been seen in a theater. Some might get it right, some might not (see the Crouching Tiger, Hidden Dragon thread for "swarming ants" complaints). I'm already getting too long winded as it is, so I'll move on.

Now, I'm not saying the grain in The Matrix is a problem one way or the other, I'm just pointing out that you can be opposed to the presentation of grain on a specific title *and* like film grain in general at the same time.

[chip75]

Originally Posted by Kazuma-

The grain is sometimes extremely annoying.

Originally Posted by jmstone

One - gotta say some of this looked amazing but other scenes were soo grainy I was embarrassed. The opening scene with Trinity is full of grain especially the cops flash lights. There was also a ton of grain in the interrogation scene with the Smiths. The white walls are so grainy as is Neo's face. Disappointing. Hard to believe this got a 5 star review for 4k.

Originally Posted by Kazuma-

not the best 4k disc, some scenes are really clear and sharp but others to grainy.

Some people swear by this stuff, they're not allowed in my home, but it's an option nevertheless.

[nick4Knight]

This old chestnut from the gallery... "It's film, stupid!". Come on now.

Anyway, personally, I'm really more troubled with this harsh asf cyan more and more each day seeing them references. Is it more nuanced/to the green side on the actual HDR experience? Just curious.

[The Fallen Deity]

It's 2018 and people are STILL complaining about grain?!

[nonametofame]

I definitely thought I was getting some weird DV issues with the picture last night as well. I don't have the DV settings dialed in with a calibration disc, but all previous viewings have looked good, sometimes better than HDR, sometimes not as consistent.

There were many instances of overblown contrast, and brights, as others have echoed. Switched to a dimmer setting, with reduced contrast (my set already has low nits) and that seemed to improve balance.

This disc wasn't quite as astonishing as Blade Runner or Saving Private Ryan, as others indicated, and what I was expecting. If you want to know my thoughts on grain, I quite enjoyed the look of Leon, A Few Good Men, and Groundhogs Day. None of those are quite as stylized but all are 90's releases, and all from Sony coincidentally (the current king of transfers).