Star Wars: The Complete Saga (1977-2005)

[octagon]

Originally Posted by OG Pooh

There's my take on my two least favorite episodes. Take notice there is one from each trilogy. Also note that I can't make up my mind, even after all these years, which I find to be the better/worse of the two.

That's very similar to where I am as well.

As much as I loved Star Wars and Empire the wheels really started to fall of with Jedi. It had its moments (most notably the Emperor/Vader/Luke showdown) but overall it just seemed too much like a loose patchwork of Obligatory Stuff That People Loved From The First Two.

And don't even get me started on Ewoks.

[Bluyoda]

Originally Posted by Lincoln6Echo

To be fair, the PT was the story of Anakin's discovery (Ep. I), Anakin's coming-of-age (Ep. II) and Anakin's fall (Ep. III).

But what the PT did at its core was to set up the excellent CG animated Clone Wars series, which of course explores, in quite some detail, what was book-ended in Ep. II and Ep. III. I believe the Clone Wars series is the best thing to happen to the Star Wars universe in quite literally, its entire existance. It has given the rich mythology, that was just hinted at in the films, the room to breathe to tell a somewhat to very compelling story of what was just hinted at in a small throw-away line in the first film that started it all. "My father fought in the Clone Wars?" "Yes"

So while the OT has given many of a fanboy their source of fanboyism, but to me, the PT has given us some rich "filmed" backstory to what we all have always dreamed about. Now make no mistake, I'm a 1st Gen. Star Wars fan. Saw ANH at the theaters twice back in '77 and perhaps in '78 during a re-release. So, I'm not a OT hater or a PT lover, or vice versa. I'm just a fan, not a fanatic.

Take Star Trek for instance. The mythos started out as a campy '60s TV show, and morphed into a film series, to which then spawned four more TV series, before going back to film. It's really ashame that Star Wars didn't go to TV sometime in the late '80s or '90s like Star Trek did. Just took a few more films (and advancements in film (CGI) technology) to open up a timeline that could be done in episodic TV.

I'm hoping the live-action series gets off the ground whenever Clone Wars wraps up. Could be cool. And a great time to be a Star Wars fan.

I guess, I should check out the Clone Wars then, as I still haven't seen a single Episode.

I love the movies. Jedi being my least favorite.

I am not sure if I should risk ordering Season 1 on BD??!?!?!?

[greg_achen]

Originally Posted by Bluyoda

I guess, I should check out the Clone Wars then, as I still haven't seen a single Episode.

I love the movies. Jedi being my least favorite.

I am not sure if I should risk ordering Season 1 on BD??!?!?!?

The Clone Wars is very good, though please hold off judgement until the second half of the first season. It takes a few episodes before the writers find their niche, but once they do, you are in for some great stories set in the galaxy far far way. Season 2 is way better than Season 1 with nary a stinker in the bunch.

The worst thing about The Clone Wars is the character design, but you get used to it. The backgrounds and effects, however, are unbelievably beautiful and is truly a wonder to behold on Blu Ray.

[s2mikey]

Originally Posted by OG Pooh

Agreed.

What kills me is how all the PT haters will site the cringe moments, yet seem oblivious to all the ones in the OT. Sure, everybody's performances in the PT weren't Oscar calibur... Have they really watched the OT? There was a lot of bad acting & bad lines there as well. It's funny how all the faults that people find in the PT can very easily be transfered to the OT, yet they still use them to make a case for their hatred of one or the other (yes it goes the other way around too). I like both trilogies. I can find faults with each trilogy, but I can both acknowledge & accept the faults of each because I love the story, the characters and all that goes with the fictional universe that is Star Wars.

Sure thing - The OT has more ham than a meat shop during Christmas. None of the actors seem very polished in that either. Guiness and Cushing are solid but the rest were just getting started. Hey - it all works out great though. Its cast perfectly and the characters are believable and very real. Thats why we love them!

The Padme/Anakin stuff in the PT is just sort of awful. In fairness to Portman and Christensen though, the direction was suspect and they didnt have a lot to work with.

[Lincoln6Echo]

Originally Posted by greg_achen

The Clone Wars is very good, though please hold off judgement until the second half of the first season. It takes a few episodes before the writers find their niche, but once they do, you are in for some great stories set in the galaxy far far way. Season 2 is way better than Season 1 with nary a stinker in the bunch.

The worst thing about The Clone Wars is the character design, but you get used to it. The backgrounds and effects, however, are unbelievably beautiful and is truly a wonder to behold on Blu Ray.

Yes, I would echo that fact as well. The thing that has puzzled me the most about Clone Wars is the character design for some characters, namely the human females. Very cartoony. And Count Dooku is a bit funny. Still can't figure out why they went with his facial design. But other than that, most character designs you can get used to. The alien designs are quite excellent ironically. Jar Jar actually looks more realistic than his film counterpart. But everything else, from the environments to the special effects, are top notch. Very cinematic quality. In fact, you could almost say that they could be used in a life-action series.

The series on BD looks amazing. The level of detail in the textures is just jaw dropping.

But I will disagree on that first point. I think the first few episodes of Season 1 were quite good. The Malevolence Trilogy were the episodes that said, "Yes, this series is gonna rock." There are a few errors in sound design in the first episode though, where the Separatist frigates use the wrong turbolaser cannon sounds. Instead of sounding like we all know they should, they sound like regular gun powder guns for some reason. Who let that one get by QC?

[Cyprian]

Originally Posted by OG Pooh

While I didn't truly hate any of the films, there were a couple that I really, really disliked. Clones wasn't one of them. I go back & forth as to which I like the least... Jedi or Phantom Menace. Here's how I look at the two of them...

Jedi: Pretty bad most of the way through. Jabba's Palace was little more than a glorified Muppet Show, with goofy slapstick at every turn. What can I even say about The Battle of Endor. Midgets & children in bad teddy bear costumes overthrow the mighty Empire with sticks & twigs. And let's not forget the greatest of all Ewok dialog... Ewok 1: That guy's wise. Ewok 2: Martin Short (WTF is that?). Harrison Ford & Carrie Fisher's performances were less than phoned-in and the Lando character was relegated to playing alongside a new alien character almost as goofy as Jar-Jar Binks. Both the Han and Lando characters were also completely wimped out beyond recognition. The only saving grace of Jedi was the battle & dialog between Luke, Vader & Palpatine. Luckily for RotJ, the throne room sequences were amongst, if not the best of the entire saga.

Phantom Menace: While I didn't find any particular aspect of it as horrible as 2/3 of Jedi, I couldn't find anything particularly great about it either. Looking at it strictly from a story standpoint, it was a virtual clone of Episode IV: A New Hope... Princess/Queen is kidnapped, Jedi finds a new trainee (named Skywalker) on Tatooine, they set out to rescue the Princess/Queen, they meet new allies along the way, the old Jedi Master is killed during the rescue, etc, etc. The only thing close to being as bad as the majority of Jedi was Jar-Jar Binks. But then again, considering the Ewoks, they kind of cancel each other out. Besides, Jar-Jar was just one character. I guess what I'm saying is that while I can't say a whole lot really bad about Phantom Menace, I can't say anything really good either.

Comparing the two, I get one that was complete crap but had an amazing saving grace, while the other wasn't as completely horrible but had no great moments either. So for me, it's a toss-up.

There's my take on my two least favorite episodes. Take notice there is one from each trilogy. Also note that I can't make up my mind, even after all these years, which I find to be the better/worse of the two.

Ok you are officially not allowed to comment on which film is bad or not bad. You got the Ewok quotes wrong. Its "That guys' wise"(U got that one right) and the second one says "Man are we short"(epic fail on that one).

P.S. I am just razzing you so please dont take seriously

[Sith]

Originally Posted by Lincoln6Echo

To be fair, the PT was the story of Anakin's discovery (Ep. I), Anakin's coming-of-age (Ep. II) and Anakin's fall (Ep. III).

To be fair, the PT is the story of(Ep. I) the framework of a galactic coup. (Ep. II) The political maneuvering of a galactic coup set in motion. (Ep. III) The successful implementation of a government takeover.

[iam1bearcat]

Originally Posted by OG Pooh

While I didn't truly hate any of the films, there were a couple that I really, really disliked. Clones wasn't one of them. I go back & forth as to which I like the least... Jedi or Phantom Menace. Here's how I look at the two of them...

Jedi: Pretty bad most of the way through. Jabba's Palace was little more than a glorified Muppet Show, with goofy slapstick at every turn. What can I even say about The Battle of Endor. Midgets & children in bad teddy bear costumes overthrow the mighty Empire with sticks & twigs. And let's not forget the greatest of all Ewok dialog... Ewok 1: That guy's wise. Ewok 2: Martin Short (WTF is that?). Harrison Ford & Carrie Fisher's performances were less than phoned-in and the Lando character was relegated to playing alongside a new alien character almost as goofy as Jar-Jar Binks. Both the Han and Lando characters were also completely wimped out beyond recognition. The only saving grace of Jedi was the battle & dialog between Luke, Vader & Palpatine. Luckily for RotJ, the throne room sequences were amongst, if not the best of the entire saga.

Phantom Menace: While I didn't find any particular aspect of it as horrible as 2/3 of Jedi, I couldn't find anything particularly great about it either. Looking at it strictly from a story standpoint, it was a virtual clone of Episode IV: A New Hope... Princess/Queen is kidnapped, Jedi finds a new trainee (named Skywalker) on Tatooine, they set out to rescue the Princess/Queen, they meet new allies along the way, the old Jedi Master is killed during the rescue, etc, etc. The only thing close to being as bad as the majority of Jedi was Jar-Jar Binks. But then again, considering the Ewoks, they kind of cancel each other out. Besides, Jar-Jar was just one character. I guess what I'm saying is that while I can't say a whole lot really bad about Phantom Menace, I can't say anything really good either.

Comparing the two, I get one that was complete crap but had an amazing saving grace, while the other wasn't as completely horrible but had no great moments either. So for me, it's a toss-up.

There's my take on my two least favorite episodes. Take notice there is one from each trilogy. Also note that I can't make up my mind, even after all these years, which I find to be the better/worse of the two.

but Ewoks are cute!

[Sith]

Originally Posted by OG Pooh

While I didn't truly hate any of the films, there were a couple that I really, really disliked. Clones wasn't one of them. I go back & forth as to which I like the least... Jedi or Phantom Menace. Here's how I look at the two of them...

Jedi: Pretty bad most of the way through. Jabba's Palace was little more than a glorified Muppet Show, with goofy slapstick at every turn. What can I even say about The Battle of Endor. Midgets & children in bad teddy bear costumes overthrow the mighty Empire with sticks & twigs. And let's not forget the greatest of all Ewok dialog... Ewok 1: That guy's wise. Ewok 2: Martin Short (WTF is that?). Harrison Ford & Carrie Fisher's performances were less than phoned-in and the Lando character was relegated to playing alongside a new alien character almost as goofy as Jar-Jar Binks. Both the Han and Lando characters were also completely wimped out beyond recognition. The only saving grace of Jedi was the battle & dialog between Luke, Vader & Palpatine. Luckily for RotJ, the throne room sequences were amongst, if not the best of the entire saga.

Phantom Menace: While I didn't find any particular aspect of it as horrible as 2/3 of Jedi, I couldn't find anything particularly great about it either. Looking at it strictly from a story standpoint, it was a virtual clone of Episode IV: A New Hope... Princess/Queen is kidnapped, Jedi finds a new trainee (named Skywalker) on Tatooine, they set out to rescue the Princess/Queen, they meet new allies along the way, the old Jedi Master is killed during the rescue, etc, etc. The only thing close to being as bad as the majority of Jedi was Jar-Jar Binks. But then again, considering the Ewoks, they kind of cancel each other out. Besides, Jar-Jar was just one character. I guess what I'm saying is that while I can't say a whole lot really bad about Phantom Menace, I can't say anything really good either.

Comparing the two, I get one that was complete crap but had an amazing saving grace, while the other wasn't as completely horrible but had no great moments either. So for me, it's a toss-up.

There's my take on my two least favorite episodes. Take notice there is one from each trilogy. Also note that I can't make up my mind, even after all these years, which I find to be the better/worse of the two.

And yet I'd pick Ewoks on there worst day over Paul Stanley, but then I'm a Slayer fan.

[JoshKelhoffer]

Originally Posted by Vertigo2010

It's true. Anytime someone talks about the bad points of PT vs OT, I always bring up Chewbacca doing to Tarzan yell in ROTJ...

ROTJ has some bad moments that are on par with most of the embarrassing scenes in the prequels.

Some that come to mind are:

-The scene outside the Ewok village, where Leia hams it up with overdramatic fluff such as "...then leeeeaavveeeee this place" and "go away...go farrrrrrr away." Then Han shows up, displaying an insecurity over Luke and Leia.

-The "I'm with you too!" scene.

-The aforementioned Tarzan scream.

-"You rebel scum!"

-Yoda's death scene, which is pretty much "cough, cough, I'm dead."

My problems with the prequels have less to do with the stories, but how they were executed, along with the poor acting and wooden dialogue.

[OG Pooh]

Originally Posted by Cyprian

Ok you are officially not allowed to comment on which film is bad or not bad. You got the Ewok quotes wrong. Its "That guys' wise"(U got that one right) and the second one says "Man are we short"(epic fail on that one).

P.S. I am just razzing you so please dont take seriously

No, actually I'm very glad you told me that...

I always thought that's what the line was, but a friend of mine convinced me that it was Martin Short. We used to argue over it all the time (whenever we watched Jedi anyway). One day, he showed me some web site that said the line was Martin Short, and was put in as a goof because someone on the effects team either knew or was related to (I don't remember which) Martin Short. It went on to say that G.L. knew about it, but let it in to see if people would catch it. Man are we short always made more sense to me. Do you have any links, so I can show him?

[PeterTHX]

Originally Posted by OG Pooh

No, actually I'm very glad you told me that...

I always thought that's what the line was, but a friend of mine convinced me that it was Martin Short. We used to argue over it all the time (whenever we watched Jedi anyway). One day, he showed me some web site that said the line was Martin Short, and was put in as a goof because someone on the effects team either knew or was related to (I don't remember which) Martin Short. It went on to say that G.L. knew about it, but let it in to see if people would catch it. Man are we short always made more sense to me. Do you have any links, so I can show him?

Puzzled on the debate over the line.

Listening to it a billion times I've always heard it as "mon-ishua"

[drobswim13]

Originally Posted by s2mikey

Sure thing - The OT has more ham than a meat shop during Christmas. None of the actors seem very polished in that either. Guiness and Cushing are solid but the rest were just getting started. Hey - it all works out great though. Its cast perfectly and the characters are believable and very real. Thats why we love them!

The Padme/Anakin stuff in the PT is just sort of awful. In fairness to Portman and Christensen though, the direction was suspect and they didnt have a lot to work with.

One of the rules of any great actor (which I have learned personally, but I wouldn't consider myself great by any means): Even with poor lines, you can make them work by making it believable. Unfortunately, neither Portman nor Christensen had the ability to make it work in this instance.

[OG Pooh]

Originally Posted by PeterTHX

Puzzled on the debate over the line.

Listening to it a billion times I've always heard it as "mon-ishua"

Funny, but after my friend convinced me that it was Martin Short, that's exactly what I've heard since. I think you hear what you think you're going to hear. Even now that someone else has said it's Man are we short, I may still hear Martin Short. Now I'll have to watch Jedi (and that's always painful until near the end).

[Duffy12]

Originally Posted by drobswim13

One of the rules of any great actor (which I have learned personally, but I wouldn't consider myself great by any means): Even with poor lines, you can make them work by making it believable. Unfortunately, neither Portman nor Christensen had the ability to make it work in this instance.

You know something, that is very interesting.

Can you imagin if Lucas had instead cast 'Brad Pitt' and 'Keira Knightley' in those rolls?

[drobswim13]

Originally Posted by Duffy12

You know something, that is very interesting.

Can you imagin if Lucas had instead cast 'Brad Pitt' and 'Keira Knightley' in those rolls?

That would be very interesting!!

The one instance that my old theatre professor used to always use was with Dustin Hoffman. He was preparing for a role (the movie actually escapes my memory at the moment) and was given some pretty horrendous lines. He worked with them and owned them. Then, a few days before shooting, the director walked up to him and said "these are the new lines for this scene. It should work much better." Apparently the lines were written much better and would have worked, but Hoffman said he wouldn't do it. He said he had perfected the first batch of lines and made it believable. A true master of the craft (and I know, you can't compare Portman and Christensen to Hoffman, but it's just an example )

[PeterTHX]

Originally Posted by Duffy12

You know something, that is very interesting.

Can you imagin if Lucas had instead cast 'Brad Pitt' and 'Keira Knightley' in those rolls?

Buttered rolls? Rolls of fat?

The boulder that rolls after Indiana Jones in Raiders?

Keira was one of Padme's handmaidens/decoys in Episode I BTW.

[P@t_Mtl]

Originally Posted by PeterTHX

Keira was one of Padme's handmaidens/decoys in Episode I BTW.

Sophia Coppola is one of them as well I I recall?

[octagon]

Originally Posted by P@t_Mtl

Sophia Coppola is one of them as well I I recall?

I don't normally believe in stuff like curses or jinxes but that would explain a LOT.

[Sith]

My Stormtrooper Commander just arrived from StarWars.com!!!