Star Wars: The Complete Saga (1977-2005)

[killermike2178]

Originally Posted by Indyjones

Star Wars fans / film buffs: How did George Lucas die?

Martin Scorcese: A young editor named Marcia Lucas, who was a pupil of mine until she turned to evil, helped "new hollywood" hunt down and destroy the up and coming talented filmmakers. She betrayed and cheated on George. Now the filmmaker in George is all but extinct. Marcia was seduced by the dark side of the Force.

I can't keep up with this thread!

Okay. Replace Marcia with George and replace the dark side of the Force with Rick McCallum's greed and there's your real answer to how George Lucas died, as a filmmaker.

[Walter E Kurtz]

Originally Posted by Shaft Windu

If some changed lines in "Hamlet" written by Shakespeare himself would pop up it would be a literary sensation! If someone would find a hidden chapter from the "Lord Of The Rings" under Tolkiens floorboards HIS fans would treasure it! So why is George Lucas who created the most complex and ambitious piece of cinema ever treated like crap by his supposed "fans"? An author, filmmaker, artist owes his fans nothing simply because he doesn't choose his fans - The fans choose the thing they love and are drawn to.

I see it as a kind of cleansing-process right now. The large nerd-herd of conservative fans finds out right now that they actually don't get Star Wars and will abandon it. Simultanously a new generation will discover the movies on Blu-Ray and in theatres next year and fill that void. Star Wars is alive and more glorious than ever and it will prevail despite the endless bickering of painfully unimaginative naysayers! OVER AND OUT!

ridiculous comparison

he is not adding a completely different chapter.

hes putting eyelids on an ewok

[kurtlingle]

Originally Posted by georgec

Wow, that took awhile to catch up. Lots of people coming out of the woodwork to express disappointment over the set.

I doubt these reports put any significant dent in the sales numbers. Lucas will get his and we'll do this dance in another few years.

Is this thread going to break the internet?

I also bet 1/2 of those people will buy them anyway (hopefully we'll get a BB 59.99 or 69.99 sale). I mean, come on, it's SW in HD with LOSSLESS sound. I can't wait.

I'm putting my DVD's on ebay this weekend. Goodbye DVD and hello blu-ray!

[LADodgers]

Originally Posted by Shaft Windu

If some changed lines in "Hamlet" written by Shakespeare himself would pop up it would be a literary sensation! If someone would find a hidden chapter from the "Lord Of The Rings" under Tolkiens floorboards HIS fans would treasure it! So why is George Lucas who created the most complex and ambitious piece of cinema ever treated like crap by his supposed "fans"? An author, filmmaker, artist owes his fans nothing simply because he doesn't choose his fans - The fans choose the thing they love and are drawn to.

I see it as a kind of cleansing-process right now. The large nerd-herd of conservative fans finds out right now that they actually don't get Star Wars and will abandon it. Simultanously a new generation will discover the movies on Blu-Ray and in theatres next year and fill that void. Star Wars is alive and more glorious than ever and it will prevail despite the endless bickering of painfully unimaginative naysayers! OVER AND OUT!

what does that even mean?

[nmycon]

Originally Posted by Shaft Windu

If some changed lines in "Hamlet" written by Shakespeare himself would pop up it would be a literary sensation! If someone would find a hidden chapter from the "Lord Of The Rings" under Tolkiens floorboards HIS fans would treasure it! So why is George Lucas who created the most complex and ambitious piece of cinema ever treated like crap by his supposed "fans"? An author, filmmaker, artist owes his fans nothing simply because he doesn't choose his fans - The fans choose the thing they love and are drawn to.

I see it as a kind of cleansing-process right now. The large nerd-herd of conservative fans finds out right now that they actually don't get Star Wars and will abandon it. Simultanously a new generation will discover the movies on Blu-Ray and in theatres next year and fill that void. Star Wars is alive and more glorious than ever and it will prevail despite the endless bickering of painfully unimaginative naysayers! OVER AND OUT!

Lucas is able to make these changes because of the fans. Things could have easily turned out differently. Star Wars could have flopped and the Saga would never have been born.

Plus, there is a difference when you decide to eliminate all traces of the previous iterations of the films... jus' sayin'...

[GuruAskew]

Originally Posted by LADodgers

Oh but he has changed film history. What he has done with these films is no different than past dictators burning or banning books.

Christ.

[hipster.doofus7]

Originally Posted by Valaquen

He added about colourisation: "There is nothing to stop American films, records, books, and paintings from being sold to a foreign entity or egotistical gangsters and having them change our cultural heritage to suit their personal taste."

And herein lies the concept that haters can never seem to grasp. Lucas is not a "foreign entity" to Star Wars. George Lucas IS Star Wars. Every single one of his quotes was about outside entities altering art in a way the artist never intended. He never said nor implied that an artist should be forbidden from altering his own works.

But angry nerds keep on seeing only what they want to see, and hearing only what they want to hear. So they keep on regurgitating the same old GL quotes over and over and over again...

[nateynate87]

Originally Posted by Inspector Toschi

I think if some folks just realized that the SE are not and never will be the UOT, than they may be able to enjoy the SE as they are. I will always prefer the UOT and hope for a pristine restoration of it. And I was as dumbfounded as any in 97. But before the DVD was released I realized that hoping for the UOT every time I watch the SE, I will always be disappointed. They're fundamentally the same trilogy, but they're clearly different entities. It's like watching the Directors cut of Blade Runner, and hoping for the theatrical cut with narration. They're different products of different times.

That's why I just can't get mad at these new changes. We knew these would be the SEs, and we knew there would be more changes. It basically comes with the territory now. But because these were never going to be the UOT to begin with, new changes just don't bother me. The SE have always been an overgrowing experiment as far as I'm concerned. And if I choose to (Which I have) I'll go along for the ride yet again.

See the thing with blade runner is if you like the theatrical cut, you can pop in the blu ray and watch it in glorious high definition!

Who knows if that will ever happen with these films....

[Jimmy Smith]

The Nooooooooooo I think is a giant FU to everyone who made fun of that moment in Revenge of the Sith. To have such contempt for the people who made you a billionare is really low

[42041]

Originally Posted by Shaft Windu

So why is George Lucas who created the most complex and ambitious piece of cinema ever

lol
i like star wars well enough, but let's settle down here...

[IndyMLVC]

Here's the link to the carbonite.
http://www.dailymotion.com/video/xkt...ray_shortfilms
Looks like SHIT.

[Beast]

Originally Posted by LADodgers

Oh but he has changed film history. What he has done with these films is no different than past dictators burning or banning books.

Not at all. Because last I checked, I didn't have a Stormtrooper at my door collecting my... Betamax, Laserdiscs, VHS, and DVD copies of the films for destruction. Lucas isn't "burning books", or any of the other lame Godwin's Law teasing comments. He's simply printing a new edition of the book with some changes. Nothing more. Get back to me when the Lucasfilm Empire starts hunting down the band of rebels with their old versions of the films.

[Beast]

Originally Posted by robmlisanti

[Show spoiler]http://www.thedigitalbits.com/#mytwocents

All right... so, Star Wars. You guys hear any good rumors today?

Kidding. My e-mail box is full this afternoon, trust me.

As I said yesterday, we don't comment on posted screenshots from Blu-rays that we haven't seen yet. Yes, we know they seem to indicate more changes that George Lucas has made to the films. But as we don't yet actually have the discs in hand, and Lucasfilm has been a little slow to respond to inquiries over the last 24 hours or so, we haven't been able to confirm. However... Lucasfilm HAS apparently told the New York Times that at least one of the changes is true, which means they probably all are. To wit, the major reported changes are thus:

1. In Episode I, Yoda is now all-digital.

2. In Star Wars, the sound effect for Ben's eerie "dragon" call that frightens off the Sandpeople has apparently been changed.

3. At the end of Return of the Jedi, Vader now screams "Noooo!" as he throws the Emperor to his death.

There are numerous other changes as well, apparently, but they're all more minor (in Jedi, the Ewoks' eyes now blink, etc, etc). Again, we don't have the discs, so we can't confirm everything. But as Lucasfilm acknowledged at their press event, "new dialogue has been added" and there are indeed "new things to spot" when you watch these films.

Predictably, the online geek community is aflame today. Here's the thing: I'm really having a hard time getting worked up about it. We've just been through this too many times now. Every time these films are released, Lucas tweaks and changes them some more. And the tweaks and changes don't really improve the films, they just make them... different. The fact is, Star Wars stopped being what I loved and remembered a very LONG time ago. The combination of the prequels, repeated digital nips and tucks to the originals (Episode IV now reminds me more of Joan Rivers than a beloved classic film), the obvious BS about the original versions "no longer existing", etc, etc - it's all left me feeling fairly ambivalent about Star Wars.

I'll admit, I've been somewhat optimistic about these Blu-rays after attending the Lucasfilm preview. And I'm still looking forward to the discs. On a positive note, it sounds like the A/V quality of these discs is excellent on the whole (at least according to the guys in Europe and China who have apparently gotten their hands on factory-leaked discs. We wouldn't know - it'll probably be week or more before we get to see them.) As expected, numerous (though not all) picture and sound defects in these films have apparently been corrected. But while it's three steps forward in quality, it may be two and a half back for more changes. As for me, I'm just going to try to enjoy the films for what there are, as opposed to what they aren't at this point. The deleted scene material is the real draw for me in this Blu-ray release anyway.

Regardless, a lot of Bits readers have been e-mailing today me expecting me to react with the same sort of outrage they're experiencing right now. Been there. Done that. I wish I could tell you that I still share your pain, but believe me I certainly understand it. The thing is, this is just the reality of Star Wars in the 21st Century. We go through this like every 5 or 6 years. Despite past experience, fans continue to expect miracles... and every time, the curtain gets pulled back and we see the guy yanking on the levers again. For better or worse. And you know, I don't hate him for it. Hell... when I was ten back in 1977 and my folks were going through an ugly divorce, I saw Star Wars one afternoon and suddenly life was pretty good. So you know, I really can't get tweaked about this stuff anymore. Maybe it's reaching middle age, but I'm just like... whatever. Life goes on. George has been fiddling with these films for 34 years now. It's probably not going to change. Fans really need to come to grips with it at long last. Hell, maybe the 501st Legion can start up a worldwide support group - a 12 Step Star Wars Recovery Plan.

Anyway, to paraphrase a wise old wizard: Maybe these aren't the droids you're looking for anymore...

We'll be sure to post our full - and fair - review of the set as soon as we get the discs. Meanwhile, I find a good walk out in the fresh air helps restore your sense of perspective in times like these. Courage, friends!

By the way, this gave me a big laugh today: Lionsgate just sent over another well-timed press release for their 10/25 DVD release of The People vs. George Lucas documentary. From the text: "With all the recent uproar over the news of further changes to the original films in this new set, fans will feel in good company as the film devotes an entire section to the changes made to the 1997 re-releases, making this the perfect compliment to the Blu-ray Discs. But the film isn't all about the changes – it also features the fans and media expressing their love and admiration of him as well." Well played, Lionsgate. Well played.

Score one for Bill Hunt. Who reacts like a reasonable mature human being. Bravo, good sir!

[Valaquen]

Originally Posted by Beast

Not at all. Because last I checked, I didn't have a Stormtrooper at my door collecting my... Betamax, Laserdiscs, VHS, and DVD copies of the films for destruction. Lucas isn't "burning books", or any of the other lame Godwin's Law teasing comments. He's simply printing a new edition of the book with some changes. Nothing more. Get back to me when the Lucasfilm Empire starts hunting down the band of rebels with their old versions of the films.

He knows he wouldn't need to do that, because: what ends up being important in my mind is what the DVD version is going to look like, because that's what everybody is going to remember. The other versions will disappear. Even the 35 million tapes of Star Wars out there won't last more than 30 or 40 years. A hundred years from now, the only version of the movie that anyone will remember will be the DVD version

[kurtlingle]

Originally Posted by El_Jay

Wellllllllllll, as usual, I sit somewhere in the middle on this.

I would have preferred that none of those changes were made, but the overreactions on the level of Lucas burning their house down and forcing himself on their mother is quite amusing.

On the other hand, it's even more amusing how the die-hard apologists are just giving a blanket "OMG IT'S AWESOME BEST THING EVER TEN THUMBS UP!!!!!!!!11" to this. I wonder how far Lucas could take this? Replace C-3PO with a Transformer? OMG best change ever! Director's intent! George Lucas! Replace blasters with knitting needles? OMG amazing! What a visionary! Make Luke Skywalker a vampire?! PERFECT! Just what this franchise always needed!

I have a hard time believing these people are even real, and not just trolls/cyborgs/Lucas employees or something.

Vader saying "NOOOOOO!" is 'awesome'? Hahaha. Oh laaaaawd.

Anyway I don't hate this new stuff enough to lose my mind over it like some obviously are, but the hardcore apologists are completely ridiculous in their capacity to just lap up literally every change George Lucas makes, as long as he approves it. It seems like he could just replace the whole movie with a romantic comedy set on Kashykk starring only Wookiees with no subtitles, and these people would still rant and rave about how it's the greatest change ever and really makes the whole "saga" come alive.

He could literally crap in a box and people would still buy it. Hold that... not just buy it, but laud it as the greatest achievement in cinema history and create 2000 IMDB accounts to rate it 10/10.

Ok, I'll take this one on.

I would be fine with a Digital Yoda - since he's wayyyy better in the PT, but I understand why Lucas would keep the puppet - and I am fine with keeping it.

I didn't like the HC ghost change, but am now used to it and am fine with it.

Why can't people just love SW and be ok with change? Why is that hard to conceive? I was looking forward to some changes and knew they'd come.

There probably won't be any new SW movies (at least it seems that way) so there is Clone Wars (which is ok) and new version (upgrades) to these movies.

I do wish Lucas would release the OOT - not for me (I'd never want to see them) but to satisfy those who want them.

[IndyMLVC]

Originally Posted by Beast

Not at all. Because last I checked, I didn't have a Stormtrooper at my door collecting my... Betamax, Laserdiscs, VHS, and DVD copies of the films for destruction. Lucas isn't "burning books", or any of the other lame Godwin's Law teasing comments. He's simply printing a new edition of the book with some changes. Nothing more. Get back to me when the Lucasfilm Empire starts hunting down the band of rebels with their old versions of the films.

Similarly, George once said about the Holiday Special:
"If I had the time and a sledgehammer, I would track down every copy of that show and smash it."

[Beast]

Originally Posted by Valaquen

I can't believe this is the same Lucas who attacked colourised movies for changing the original thing. He said about The Three Stooges colourised version: Maybe just the fact that they're in black and white makes it funny, because their humor is dated. But by putting it in black and white, it puts it in a context where you can appreciate it for what it was. But you try to make it in full living color and try to compare it to a Jim Carrey movie, then it's hard for young people to understand. ... It's not fair to the artist."

He added about colourisation: "There is nothing to stop American films, records, books, and paintings from being sold to a foreign entity or egotistical gangsters and having them change our cultural heritage to suit their personal taste."

I mean ... wow

For the.. 16th Million time in the history of mankind. That is about someone other than the Creator altering films.

[nmycon]

Originally Posted by kurtlingle

Ok, I'll take this one on.

I would be fine with a Digital Yoda - since he's wayyyy better in the PT, but I understand why Lucas would keep the puppet - and I am fine with keeping it.

I didn't like the HC ghost change, but am now used to it and am fine with it.

Why can't people just love SW and be ok with change? Why is that hard to conceive? I was looking forward to some changes and knew they'd come.

There probably won't be any new SW movies (at least it seems that way) so there is Clone Wars (which is ok) and new version (upgrades) to these movies.

I do wish Lucas would release the OOT - not for me (I'd never want to see them) but to satisfy those who want them.

If the changes actually looked good, I'd be fine. But R2 D2 hiding... the carbonite... Luke's saber... I could do better than this on my computer...

[LADodgers]

Originally Posted by Valaquen

He knows he wouldn't need to do that, because: what ends up being important in my mind is what the DVD version is going to look like, because that's what everybody is going to remember. The other versions will disappear. Even the 35 million tapes of Star Wars out there won't last more than 30 or 40 years. A hundred years from now, the only version of the movie that anyone will remember will be the DVD version

err....BD version!
He will need to revise that statement.

[Valaquen]

Originally Posted by LADodgers

err....BD version!
He will need to revise that statement.

Maybe with a computer.